Diversity/ Is magic different across cultures?

[Edblanning at aol.com]

No: HPFGUIDX 40774

Catlady:
> Eloise wrote:
> 
> << On another level, I feel that it is implying an assumption that 
> all races living in Britain should conform to the European magical 
> tradition. (I know that JKR's particular brand of magic is an 
> invention of her own, but she *portrays* it as a European tradition, 
> doesn't she?) We don't assume that all races should follow European 
> traditions of religion, dress, cultural customs, etc. So why magic?>>
> 
> I understand that it's very politically incorrect to speak of 
> 'assimilation' or to suggest that there might be a 'melting pot', 
> but, look, I don't speak a word of Yiddish and Tim doesn't speak a 
> word of Gaelic. We both wear jeans, and eat with knife and fork 
> (sometimes Tim uses chopsticks, so I accuse him of showing off), 
> changing the fork to right hand to put the food in our mouths with
> it, and we are pretty much obsessed with the Constitution and the 
> Bill of Rights (and the Treaty of Guadelupe Hildago, but that's 
> another thing) even tho' none of our ancestors were in USA yet when 
> those were signed...  I don't seem to be able to say clearly what I 
> 

Nor can I! it's a tricky one!
Of course, in the UK there are many people of various ethnic groups who 
regard themselves as primarily British and whose life style is no different 
from my own. But there are others, whose lifestyles are quite different, who 
do normally speak Hindi, or Gujarati, or Ghanaian, a Chinese dialect, etc., 
etc., many of whom dress according to their own customs, celebrate according 
to their own customs, live lifestyles reflecting those of their ancestral 
homeland and who still have strong links with family overseas. It was of 
these whom I was thinking. 

In addition, RL schools spend time promoting cultural awareness, both helping 
children to understand the cultures of others and affirming the diverse 
traditions of pupils of different races.
What I was simply pointing out is that although Hogwarts is multi-racial, it 
is mono-cultural. It reflects British racial diversity, but not British 
cultural diversity. I don't think it *could* do the latter. I am glad that it 
does do the former, for reasons I have already stated.

I've just realised that some Americans might be taken aback by my implication 
that some UK citizens don't regard themselves as primarily British. 
Becoming a British citizen isn't accompanied by the same swearing of 
allegience, obligation to learn English, etc, as becoming an American citizen 
is. We are also usually (when we're not having a Jubilee) rather diffident 
about parading national pride. Things that are seen as normal expressions of 
being American, if translated into British terms, would seem distinctly 
jingoistic and there isn't quite the same strong sense over here of having 
pride in 'being British' that you have in 'being American', I think. I don't 
think many people could really put their finger on what it means, these days. 
Perhaps it is partly because it has overtones of imperialism that we'd rather 
forget.
This year has been quite exceptional in the way that people have flown the 
flag and shown pride in their Britishness.
I could go on, but I think I've strayed far enough OT! 

...................
Naama:
>A more fitting analogy may be engineering. It isn't really meaningful 
>to talk of European engineering, Chinese engineering or Aztec 
>engineering, is it? Engineering is the same all over the world, since 
>it rests on objective forces and laws of nature. 
>Magic as a cultural construct we have in the real world. In the 
>Potterverse, magic is a real, objective force. Learning the rules and 
>the various ways of using this force shouldn't differ between 
>different cultures, then. 
>At least, there may be local developments. Wizards from one community 
>may find (or make?) spells that are not known in another community. 
>Unlike cultural customs, however, those spells would work just as 
>well in the other community (if practiced there). To return to the 
>engineering analogy, it would be like an American engineer learning 
>the specific methods involved in building a pagoda. 
>Following on this, then, I'd say that parents wouldn't mind where 
>their children learnt magic - so long as it's at a good school (in 
>the same way that you wouldn't mind where your kid learns 
>engineering, or biology, or physics, etc.).

I agree completely that there are universal, unvarying principles behind 
engineering, as presumably there should be behind magic, if it exists. But, 
as you say there *are* local variations. The expression of the science of 
engineering, through the art of architecture is, as you have indicated, 
highly variable. And diffferent societies use different technologies to 
achieve different results which are dependent on the same principles of 
engineering.

There are two places from which I draw my analogies, as some of you by now no 
doubt know. ;-)
If we look at ancient societies, some of these raised monuments which 
obviously depend on the same principles of engineering, but using methods 
that we can only guess at. We actually don't *know* how the Egyptians raised 
their obelisks, or exactly how the Stonehenge trilithons were put into place, 
or how the Olmecs transported the vast heads that they sculpted. They didn't 
have our technologies and we don't fully understand theirs.
So although the underlying principle is the same, the method of achieving it 
may be quite different. Could not the same be true of magic?

I could also draw an analogy from music. Perhaps this is quite close. Music 
depends on the same *scientific* principles the world over. Yet it has 
developed in very different ways, with many different modes of expression. 
Now it happens that one school of music, the western, has come to dominate 
much of the world. Musicians of many, many nationalities and cultural 
backgrounds learn, play, listen to western music. But this does not deny 
thriving traditions of quite different forms of music in other cultures. And 
of course, even within western classical music, there have been 'national' 
movements.
Although the principles underlying the magic might be the same, it is 
possible that different cultures might want to use magic to different ends.

I don't think I'm saying anything much different from you in prinicple, 
although I see the cultural element as potentially more important.

Eloise






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