TBAY: MD's third strain QB

[Melody]

No: HPFGUIDX 47034

Melody drummed her fingers on the table trying to figure out where to
go from here.  Abigail was *definitely* not backing down, which Melody
found quite honorable, but Melody needed a breather.  A moment to
recollect her thoughts and remind herself why she can here in the
first place.  Plus she needed more orange juice anyway.

"Abigail, excuse me a minute.  *Trust me*.  I'll be back soon," Melody
smiled sweetly but with a little forbearing.

"Of course.  I'll be here with bells on," Abigail said while lifting
her Pina Colada.

Wanting to waste no time, Melody hopped up and went over to the bar.
She placed her empty glass on the bar and breathed a deep sigh.
She did not know if she could do this.  This theory is too large, too
menacing to keep tabs on really.  She was desperately afraid she would
botch it all up and then she would *definitely* hear about it later in
the Safe House.

George walked up and took the empty glass.  "More orange juice, kid?"

"No, gets a bit much at times, and my stomach is quite uneasy.  Can I
have just plain water?" Melody asked.

George looked even harder at the girl.  "Honey, not many in here just
drink water.  Not too sure it is safe actually.  But, nevertheless,
here you go."

And with that he filled a fresh glass with water and placed it in
front of the girl.  Seeing how timid the girl looked, George patted
her hand and said, "Don't let them get to you."

Melody bullied up her best smile and replied, "There are just so many
of them, and Pip and Grey are missing.  I am not strong enough for this."

"Yes, you are.  And you'll win first prize at the fair tomorrow.  And
become a world famous inventor." George said with a twinkle in his eye.

"Don't you think you lost *a lot* of listees with that one George."
Melody laughed but knew exactly what he was getting at.

"It was not meant for them kid," George winked.

Feeling better, Melody rose to met her fate.  "Very well, I am off to
the fair."

Melody with water in hand turned to the back room again.  She took one
step when Alla came up to her and grabbed her hand.

"Are you the creator of MD?" Alla asked.

"Ha.  Please I am not that clever nor ingenious.  Pip is all that and
a bag of chips," Melody praised.

"Oh, but you at least support MD, right?" asked Alla with much sincerity.

"Quite right.  How many I help you?" Melody said leaning against the
bar and taking a refreshing drink of good plain old water.

"If future books will tell us that Dumbledore did absolutely nothing
to actively help Voldemort's resurrection(of course then Shrieking
shack also should be read as PRESSURE COOKER reads it) does it mean
that MAGIC DISHWASHER would be disproved?  This is the cornerstone of
the theory, right?" Alla asked looking straight into Melody's eyes.

"Ah, a part of what Abigail wants to know it seems too.  MD is a
theory and is subject to the same checks and balances as the rest of
them.  MD is resting solely on the fact that Dumbledore has created a
working plan to bring Voldemort back to life so that Voldemort is no
longer a threat to the WW.  That is the theory in 30 words or less,
though I doubt Grey's mega post will be that brief.  Within this plan,
Dumbledore has worked through out the past four books to bring the
event in GoF to life.

If, in fact, we find out in future books that Dumbledore has not been
scheming and planning and it is proven that he in fact has not helped
bring about the rebodiment of Voldemort, then MD is disproven and
there would be a big party thrown by Marina at the tavern I assure
you.  MD's hands are completely tied to the fact that Dumbledore is a
general of war and that he has made aggressive strategic plans to end
the war.  Did that answer your question?" Melody asked a bit hoarse.

"Yes, thank you." Alla said turning away to enjoy the fun.

Raising herself off the bar, Melody trudged her way back to the room,
and once again, stopped at the doorway.  Still no sign of Grey and
Pip, so she leaned her head against the frame.  Drawing her courage
and squaring her jaw, Melody strode forward to an awaiting Abigail who
had a bit too big of a smile on her face.

Settling in Melody asked, "So where were we?"

Placing her glass down, Abigail crossed her arms on the table and
began, "You were saying that MAGIC DISHWASHER is subject only to a
direct contradiction from within canon.  I find that very convenient.
May I ask what makes MD so special?"

"Um, it is not," Melody said wondering how Abigail thought Melody
implied it to be.

But, Abigail was rolling with her point and said, "Because I could
just as easily argue that the depravities that Arthur perpetrated
while under the Imperius curse are too much for his young children to
hear, and that therefore we should be content that he is a happy,
well-adjusted person, and suffice ourselves with the implication that
there was a darker undertone to his life - one that is better left
unsaid."

"Wait, I think I gave a bad example before..." Melody tried to interject.

Abigail kept straight on course though.  "No, we could not!" exclaimed
Abigail, "And if you believe that we could than I am afraid we have
come to a parting of the ways. You have left me, and other MD
objectors, with no means of arguing against the theory."

"I doubt you will ever not be able to argue against *the theory*,"
Melody said widening her eyes to emphasize the last bit.  "After all
you have no canon now to disprove it yet you still keep picking.  I
see no reason why if future books do not flat out confirm or disprove
MD you will not be able to argue against us.  Besides I think we would
miss the challenge."

Abigail said, "But you see, If we claim that Dishwasher is out of
character for, say, Dumbledore, you pull out the fireman analogy -
which I came up with, by the way -"

"I never said you didn't.  In fact, you said it was yours," Melody
pointed out.  She pulled out a little recorder that all Safe House
members are issued upon moving in and rewinded the tape a ways to get
to this part.

--"Ok first, did you hear my fireman analogy?" Abigail asked hoping to
keep this short.--

"You said 'my'." Melody said putting the recorder away.

"Oh." Abigail said a bit surprised to hear her own voice.  "I need to
get me one of those.  Anyway, as I was saying, if we claim that
Dishwasher is out of character for, say, Dumbledore, you pull out the
fireman analogy and leave us looking like sentimental fools."

Melody looked up at the woman shaking her head.  "You do not look like
sentimental fools.  Or at least, *I* don't think y'all do."

"If we argue that the theory puts Dumbledore at the center of the
books, you cry 'Metathinking!', even though many of us find the idea
of treating the books as if they took place in the real world just as
problematic.  And now you claim to be canon-proof?  And make no
mistake about it, claiming that you don't need verification in canon
is just a hop and a skip away from claiming that all canon
contradiction is, in fact, a lie or a misdirection."

Abigail pauses and realizes that she may have just gone too far.
Certainly Melody seems a bit upset.  "I'm sorry, but you don't get to
set your own rules.  There are those of us who have legitimate
concerns about MD, and you won't let us express them I hope you can
understand how that makes me a bit upset."

"I am upset.  Partly because I came too late to know all that has
transpired here, but also because you think we are being unfair and
conniving little theorists," said Melody looking down at her glass as
she swirled the water.  "I do believe that all theories are on equal
canon proving ground.  All theories can be disproven or proven in the
next three books.  But gracious Abigail, there are *a lot* of theories
out there that could stay a theory.  Just because it has not been
proven does not mean it does not exist.  The canon that backs those
theories up is in the books already, and the theory is just a
different way to read the text.  Now whether we think it is a good
theory or not is left for us to decide.  The theory remains just a
theory without the backing of the next three books and does not become
proven *fact*.

I do not think that just because the text does not point blank address
the theory that it did not happen.  JKR has herself said that she has
written back stories of the characters.  I see no problem in wondering
and piecing together these stories even when they are not directly in
the book.  That *is* the fun of it.

Now haven said all that, I will say in all likelihood given that MD is
a *major* theory surround all that has happened so far, I truly doubt
the future canons will not in some way prove or disprove major chunks
of it.  I think the detractors are a bit worried that their
reservations to MD will have to continue on further, and that we three
the supporters will only become more crafty in our defense."

Melody stopped with her eyes twinkling.  She *thrives* on this.
Continuing a little further, she said, "But we have not broken any
rules from my viewpoint.  We are just looking at all possibilities.
The theory could conceivably no be proven.  Just as it could be
proven.  We have no problem with this, but it seems you definitely do.
 Personally, I want the theory to be proven and become a fact instead
of staying a theory, but that should be no surprise to you."

"Anyway," Abigail said wanting to change the subject to more pertinent
issues, "What about my problems with the logistics of Dumbledore's
actions?"

"Are you second guessing the one wizard that is considered the
greatest among all of WW?" Melody says shaking her head.  "If he
cannot find a way.  No one will it seems.  After all, we have Fudge
choosing to be lazy one-man fireman.  He says, 'Hey, *if* the time
comes, we will be able to save the inhabitants.'  Dumbledore is not
that optimistic.  He knows better.  What he and the old crowd devise
to bring down the fire hazard (i.e. Voldemort for those still
clueless) *is* the best they can come up with.  Whether you think it
is still foolish is a Monday morning quarterback opinion."

"It is not when you have yet to offer convincing proof of the
existence of Dumbledore's over-reaching master plan." Abigail insists.
"So far, MAGIC DISHWASHER reads like Dumbledore is constantly rolling
with the punches. Whether or not he orchestrated the Philosopher's
Stone ordeal, by the beginning of CoS he is already planning to ensure
that Voldemort's return is achieved only through using Harry's blood -
but look at all the elements he leaves to chance!  He needs Voldemort
to have Pettigrew at his side, but that only happens because Sirius
Black escapes from prison.  I forget, does MD hold that Dumbledore
knew Sirius was innocent before The Shrieking Shack?"

"Really there are two frames on mind there," Melody said while resting
her glass on the table.  "Either way really, Dumbledore may of had his
suspicions about Black's innocence, but he had enough reservations to
still believe that Black could be the DE all the WW believed him to
be.  By MD, Dumbledore did not *know* Black was completely innocent
till he talked to him in Flitwick's office after the shack."

"Well then since he didn't, then how exactly did he plan to provide
Voldemort with a faithful servant to help his resurrection? And if he
did, then how could he be certain that Sirius would still be sane
enough to escape Azkaban, that the Weasley's picture would be in the
paper, that Scabbers would be in that picture, that Sirius would see
the paper, that it would motivate him to escape, that he wouldn't be
recaptured, and finally that The Shrieking Shack would even occur in a
way in which Pettigrew would be released with a life debt to Harry?
There's simply too much here that can go wrong if you ask me."

"There is a lot that can go wrong.  You try and control the variables
you can, but really it is all left to chance often times.  I cannot
deny that.  How convenient that the Weasley's won that lottery.  How
convenient that there was a photographer in Egypt to take *and* pose
that picture for the Daily Prophet.  How convenient that Fudge does
visit Azkaban and knew that Black was not in the same state as the
other prisoners.  Was even - what did he say - I was shocked at how
*normal* Black seemed (PoA Ch 10) - shocked.  I would think Fudge the
owlposter to Dumbledore would tell him this development, don't you?
All those events could of been influenced and help bring about said
results.

As to the shrieking shack developments, that really is Pip's expertise
and I think she has explained it too many times to repeat it here.  If
you think it has too many variables, well, that is you fair right to
your opinion, but I do not find it to be that way.  All the best laid
plans are subject to a world of possibilities.  Even in wartimes, the
weather and seasons bring about more battle conclusions than actually
training.  Then there is the whole issue of health and well-being and
the virtue of dry socks...

Variable are all around us, and just because Dumbledore's plan is
subject to them does not mean he is not working to bring about *this*
plan.  And if this one does not work, then he can go to plan C and
start from there.  Voldemort is still in vapour form during and after
PoA so really Dumbledore still has the advantage.  What MD is saying,
is that this plan is the best one on the table for the circumstances
of the situation."

Abigail leaned back on the legs of her chair kneading her head with
her fingertips.  "Didn't you come here because of what I said about
Dishwasher!Dumbledore?" she asked.

"That's right." Melody said. "You said that Dishwasher!Dumbledore has
two problems...."

"Whoa, whoa, whoa!" Abigail cried.  "There you go, twisting my words
right at the start!  At no point did I say that the two qualities I
described Dumbledore as having were 'problems'. I deliberately used
the word 'trait'. You are once again assuming that I've made a moral
determination about Dishwasher!Dumbledore when in fact nothing could
be further from the truth." She gave Melody an appraising look.  "You
know, I don't think you DISHWASHER people are as morally relativist as
you like to think. And, boy, do you ever have a persecution complex!"

"Well, we are spies," Melody said also leaning back to rest her
crossed ankles on the table. "It pays to be paranoid."

"I would check the equipment at the Safe House, if I were you," sassed
Abigail. "Because you certainly heard me wrong."

"Actually no I did not hear you wrong.  You called Dumbledore a liar.
 That is a moral decision to be made.  To say he out and out lied goes
against every major religions viewpoint on the issue."

"Look," Abigail said clumping her chair down again on all fours and
leaning into the table.  "The whole reason I named those 'traits' of
Dumbledore was to say he would approve Snape killing Karkaroff.
Dishwasher!Dumbledore, over all the other varieties of theories on his
character, would say yes.  He is out to win this war and allowing a
guilty DE, who will probably be killed anyway, be killed by an ex-DE,
who might or might not have a taste for such things, would be a good
plan of war IMO."

"How is that not reducing himself to the ground of Crouch Sr. though?"
Melody fired back letting her chair clump to the ground.  "He is
directly condoning the death of a perceived 'redeemed' character
without their written consent.  It is one thing to let Peter scurry
away to his master to make decisions as he will, but a whole other
thing to say we need this person killed to get you into the inner
circle of Voldie again.  At *NO* time does Dishwasher!Dumbledore ever
give any resemblance of a man who thinks principles are worthless and
the ends fit the means.  Gracious, that is what Voldemort says is his
creed!  'There is only power, and those to weak to seek it.'"

"But people have DIED!  And it is on Dumbledore's hands.  He cannot
wash away that blood since he is a major factor to the reason those
death happened anyway.  And since he has the blood already on his
hands, what is that small jump to actually order the death of
Karkaroff in the hands of Snape.  Blood on hands is the same whether
it comes from direct orders or not!" Abigail said as she stood up,
pushed back her bar stool, and glared at Melody.

"She is quite passionate about this," Melody observed quietly.

Abigail continued, "Dumbledore passed the point of no return long ago
- he is now committed to this course of action and *must* - if he is
to maintain any credibility - stop at nothing to achieve his goal."

"So let me get this straight," Melody began placing her glass in the
middle of the table.  "Dumbledore, said glass, has concocted this plan
to bring about Voldemort's rebodiment.  He works with a group of
people to brainstorm as the proper way to bring this evil to a
conclusion.  All his plans have a possibility of bring about more
deaths, but he seems to be fine with that since if they do not come up
with a plan, Voldemort would kill them anyway.  He puts into motion
plan A and then plan B, and plan B works.  Unfortunately a few people
along the way do die," Melody grabs the salt and pepper shaker and
turns them over next to the glass.  "Now, these shakers are dead
period.  And Dumbledore is now tied to them and must make their deaths
not in vain.  Am I correct so far?"

"Yes.  It is his duty to make sure evil is destroyed so Frank Bryce
and Bertha Jorkins have a point in death.  They are just not victims
of war but really, in a way, heroes." Abigail said with honor.

"So you are arguing that Dishwasher!Dumbledore should honor the dead
and make decisions that would bring about the conclusion even if it
means *directly* causing a death?  The ends justify the means, so he
would sleep at night?" Melody asked looking up at her tablemate.  She
hoped she was understanding this correctly this time.  "Morality
aside, Dumbledore should acknowledge the fact that he is a general and
thus he should make those tough decisions like to kill one life to
save countless others."

A light clicked on in Melody's head.  "Gracious, he does sound rather
'God-like' that way, doesn't he?" she pointed out.  "But, like God
with his son, God did not kill Jesus.  The mob and Rome did that.
That does not mean God didn't have a master plan for it all."

"Oh, dear I am entering the stick realm of religion parallels again,"
Melody observed and looked around nervously.

But she continued nonetheless, "In this case Dumbledore is like God.
He places people in situations where they alone make decisions as to
their fate.  Given the time Dumbledore has taken in shaping Harry's
character and learning Harry's views of the world, I think Dumbledore
knows how Harry will decide and rest in the knowledge that Harry will
go in the ways he was raised.  Dishwasher!Dumbledore *never* decides
those decisions for anyone.  He never forced a fate on anyone either.
 He observes the world and people around him and uses that knowledge
to bring about Voldie's demise."

Looking across the table to Abigail, Melody rested her chin on her
folded hands on the table.  She was exhausted.  "I do see your point,
Abigail." Melody said trying to sound convinced.  "Dumbledore is
already playing in a grey area so what is so bad about Karkaroff's
death?  I guess I see Snape's justified murder as being *completely*
evil even if the intentions are good.  Kind of like people's
reservations about Harry killing Voldemort at point blank range.  If
he does that, he is a murderer.  Plain and simple.  BUT this is war,
and war has its own morals.  Snape murdering Karkaroff is a step
further than *I* think Dishwasher!Dumbledore wants to go.  Maybe that
is my opinion and maybe your appraisal of D!D is possible, but I find
it to be against the character at present glance."

"So am I wrong in my assertions?" Abigail asked.

"No, I don't think so.  It is just a view of the events at present
surrounding Dumbledore.  For you the death of Karkaroff is not a
problem for D!D.  For my views of D!D it is.  For me D!D would not
stoop so low.  The morals of the story so far allude to this fact, but
it is possible that the murder of Karkaroff could be interpreted as a
necessary evil.  Just like the death of Peter could be interpreted as
a necessary evil.  But the morals on such situations has been stated
by Harry.  Death is death.  And the person causing the death has that
on their shoulders.  I do not think JKR will create that much grey on
the issue by saying Karkaroff's death is justified, and Peter's wasn't."

Abigail looked down at her empty glass.  "Hmm, seems I need a refill
now.  Hold on a minute.  I'll be back."  And with that, she got up and
bounced in the direction of George, leaving Melody wondering if she
has done MD justice.


Melody