Umbridge's Rape (Was: Is Umbridge a Half-Breed???)

[jwcpgh]

No: HPFGUIDX 78151

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, > Abigail wrote: 
> [huge snip]
> > I'm not pleased by the way JKR wrote Umbridge.  The immediate 
> > reaction to OOP is that finally JKR has remembered her female 
> > readers.  She gives us Tonks and Emmeline Vance, makes Molly 
> > significant in the Order, brings Ginny to the fore and makes 
> > McGonagal infinitely more interesting than she ever was before.  
> > But then there's Umbridge, and the readers who delight in the 
> > assumption that she was raped, because the stuck-up bitch 
> > deserved it.

> "jsmgleaner" <jsmgleaner at y...> wrote:

<snip> I had meant to point out that the many calls for Umbridge to 
receive more 
> punishment, particularly physical punishment, or the excitement 
about the 
> centaurs' possible revenge/justice can be read in another way, 
paying 
> attention to the overall ethics JKR is mapping out.  My point is 
that JKR uses 
> Umbridge to place her readers in the position of acting like Barty 
Crouch, Sr., 
> throwing important ethical boundaries out the window in order to 
fight evil on 
> its own terms.  Just as Crouch allows aurors to use the illegal 
curses and 
> throws suspects into prison without trial (Sirius), readers are 
suddenly forced 
> to confront their own reactions to an ostensibly bad character who 
has done 
> wrong but is taken down for it, but not within a justice system.

<snip> ...the fact that she represents the kind of mundane evil that 
proliferates 
> during times of crises was very important, and I think it speaks 
back to the first 
> war with LV (through Crouch Sr.) and looks forward to Harry and 
others 
> realizing that people who are on the bad side don't always know 
they are (or 
> know they are helping it), which will make the ethics of the last 
two books 
> more mature.  I hope.
> 
> --jsmgleaner, who is fascinated by the Umbridge character, and not 
just 
> because of her visceral reaction as a teacher

Laura:

A few things:

First, in my original post asking for ideas on punishments for 
Umbridge, I did make it clear that any punishment imposed should be 
*after* a public trial.  If the WW didn't learn anything else last 
time around, I hope that they learned that in the realm of law, the 
ends do NOT justify the means.  Corrupt procedure leads to corrupt 
results-just ask Sirius (if you can find him...sigh).  

Second, I think Fudge and Umbridge are quite aware that they're 
flirting with serious danger in their behavior.  Their hubris lets 
them convince themselves that they can control the situation.  But 
Fudge knows in his heart that LV is back and it's only a matter of 
time before things explode.  If they hadn't realized it before, the 
escape of the DEs from Azkaban and the defection of the dementors is 
all the evidence anyone should need.  I don't think they deserve the 
benefit of the doubt here-they chose to obstruct the good guys, which 
is tantamount to helping the bad guys.

Third, you won't find a more dedicated feminist than me out there, 
but the reality is that some women are bad people.  If the entire 
spectrum of human behavior doesn't apply to us, we aren't really 
human, are we?  There are real-life examples of Umbridge out there-
Phyllis Schafly, for instance, and her ilk, who act very "feminine" 
but are vicious and dangerous people.  Women like that don't, in my 
opinion, like themselves for being women and they don't like other 
women who challenge them.  JKR can't be accused of woman-bashing 
because she shows us a villain whose prototype can be found in real 
life-probably more often than the Bellatrix in-your-face-Cruella-
Deville type.

Having said all that, I am wierded out by the rape stuff too.  That 
seems so *not* JKR to me.  And I also agree that the centaurs 
wouldn't lower themselves-well, you know what I mean.