Looks aren't everything! (was:Re: Sirius / Severus)

[greatlit2003]

No: HPFGUIDX 86560

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "jwcpgh" <jwcpgh at y...> wrote:

> 
> I think this is way too simplistic.  Granted, good-looking people 
> start out with an advantage.  But there's a lot more to the 
> differences than just looks.

Looks aren't everything, it's true. But a good-looking person is 
often given a certain amount of respect from the very beginning. We 
don't know what happened in MWPP's first year, but I'm guessing that 
kids just were drawn to Sirius because he was handsome and cool. I'm 
also pretty sure that kids avoided Severus from the beginning. In 
spite of what Sirius said about Severus hanging out with "a gang of 
Slytherins" I will not give much weight to that until there is more 
canon to back it up. Sirius made out Snape to be a bully in GoF 
(many readers speculated that Snape was intimidating and belligerant 
while at school. In OoP, he is made out to be more of a loner, 
picked on by the popular bullies.)
 
> Given what we know about the Snape and Black families, we infer 
that 
> neither of them were good places in which to be reared.  We know 
for 
> sure that the Blacks were pretty awful.  We can only theorize 
about 
> the Snapes based on what Harry sees in Severus's memories, but I 
> think that the cowering child was Severus.  The question is, what 
> effect did their early years have on Sirius and Severus?  
><snip>

<   I don't think it 
> was only Snape's unattractiveness that resulted in his being an 
> outcast.  I think it was everything about him-his attitude, his 
> demeanor, his interests.  His looks just reflected what was 
inside.  

Do looks really reflect what is inside? Some people are brilliant in 
certain aspects of their lives, while they don't have a clue about 
other aspects. I've known many intelligent, thoughtful people who 
did not know what to do with their appearance. Isn't it possible 
that Snape was just a conventionally unattractive person with a 
tendency for oily hair and skin? Maybe he hadn't heard of the proper 
skincare and haircare products--perhaps he didn't care, or didn't 
have the money. As for the graying underpants, again, he might be a 
bit sloppy with his hygeine, but that doesn't necessariy reflect 
what is inside. In other aspects of his life, Snape is brilliantly 
careful--potion-making, spying on V-mort...

> It's easy enough to see how and why Snape ended up with the 
> personality he has.  But Sirius is a more complex question.  How 
did 
> he come to reject his family values at such a young age?  This is 
a 
> kid who was brought up with power, position, money and prestige.  
He 
> can't have had much exposure to the non-pureblood component of the 
> WW.  

Perhaps it's the Snape fan in me, but maybe you're giving Sirius too 
much credit here :) Sirius is an interesting person, you're right. 
But he is likeable because he is such a good friend to the Potters. 
Thus, he is portrayed in a positive way in the books, which are in 
Harry's perspective. But in other sides of his life, I don't think 
Sirius is that great of a person, nor did he completely shake off 
his family values. I think that Sirius explained his past in a 
simplistic way for Harry to understand, but adults know that it is 
difficult, if not impossible, to shake off all the values one is 
raised with. I don't think that Sirius shook off everything that his 
family taught him when he ran away. Even as an adult, he has 
arrogance, pride, a strong, rebellious personality. As a teenager, 
he thought it would be funny to have a fellow student eaten by a 
werewolf. He had to get all of these traits from somewhere (maybe 
his mother?) I think Sirius just rejected the whole notion of pure-
blood superiority because he didn't want his parents to control who 
he became friends with. But he retained many other Black family 
qualities.


<snip>
> As a child, Sirius had every advantage the WW could offer.  He 
would 
> have had no reason to turn his back on his parents' world.  But 
> somehow he did.  His being placed in Gryffindor is a bit of a 
> mystery.  

Again, I think that this was another form of rebellion. Sirius 
rejected one part of his family's beliefs, and didn't want to hang 
out with his annoying cousins, so he may have asked to go into a 
different House.

<snip>
> 
> Whatever it was that caused the Hat to place Sirius in Gryffindor, 
> it wasn't his looks.  

I agree. :)

>And it wasn't his looks that made the other 
> Marauders befriend and trust him.  It was his behavior-his whole-
> hearted adoption of the values of Hogwarts (the Hogwarts of DD, of 
> course) and of Gryffindor.  

I don't think that Sirius adopted all of the values of DD. If he 
had, he wouldn't have called Snape "Snivellus" in the kitchen of #12 
Grimmauld Place. In fact, I think that one of the beauty of the 
books is the cooperation of people with different backgrounds and 
values. DD knows that the members of the Order do not share his 
beliefs in everything. They are all just united under the goal of 
getting rid of the common enemy.  I recall Mrs. Weasley questioning 
Mundungus about where he learned right from wrong. I'm not sure 
there is such a thing as the "whole-hearted adoption of the values 
of Hogwarts". 

>Sirius's attractiveness had to 
> contribute to his general popularity, of course, but that wasn't 
> what made him the person he was.  It was what was inside.

Again, the Snape fan in me says: what was so great about what was 
inside? :) Sirius was a haughty, thoughtless bully. He may not have 
called anyone a "mudblood" but he inflicted plenty of damage in his 
own way. But he got away with it because he was handsome and popular.

For me, one of the best things about OoP was the presentation of 
characters in a more realistic way. Harry begins to see that his 
family and friends are not as one-dimensional as he had imagined. DD 
doesn't have all the answers, James is not a saint, and Snape is not 
just a bad guy. Sirius, in spite of his many bad qualities, deserves 
to be applauded for loving and taking care of Harry.

greatlit2003
who can't wait to see whether Harry will continue with Potions