Veritaserum and Truth Potions (was 'How do you end the effect of veritaserum?')

[Aimee Stapler]

No: HPFGUIDX 52494

Finwitch said:

>Well - I think that one can't speak untruth under Veritaserum
>regardless of how strong it is.
>Under influence of a Veritaserum of lesser strength, how ever, some
>options are possible, I think..

>1) refusal to answer.
>2) careful choice of words.

It would seem to me that any sort of Truth Potion, no matter the strength, 
has the power to render the individual completely -unaware- of the actions 
and -unable- to stop from speaking the truth -- there seems to be no 
personal choice in the matter.

One of the things that struck me most about the use of Veritaserum in GoF 
was the description of Crouch Jr. as Dumbledore interrogated him. "Crouch's 
son opened his eyes. His face was slack, his gaze unfocused. Dumbledore 
knelt before him, so that their faces were level[t]he man's eyelids 
flickeredCrouch took a deep, shuddering breath, then began to speak in a 
flat, expressionless voice," (US hardback, pg 683-684). This diction 
suggests wholly that Crouch Jr. is not under his own control, he is speaking 
because the serum is extracting the information, much as a computer search 
will yield data. It is emotionless, "flat, expressionless" -- there is no 
"person" behind what is being said.

I have always been under the impression that Crouch Jr. was -not- even aware 
of what he was saying. The Veritaserum has a hypnotic effect -- Crouch Jr. 
will not respond to Winky's pleas, but answers factually and concisely to 
Dumbledore's questions, as if he is completely unaware of everything else 
around him.

He does smile "insanely" several times throughout the scene, which could 
suggest, on some level, conscious recognition of what is being said -- 
emotion. These grins, however, come at the precise time that Crouch Jr. 
recalls (1) the arrival of Voldemort and his father's subsequent 
"imprisonment", and (2) the events of that evening: the success and the 
reward he expects will follow. It can be argued rather well that Crouch Jr. 
is truly entwined with Voldemort and deeply, deeply dedicated; one would 
expect, from a follower of such obsessive status, the entire focus of that 
person's life to be on the "thing" -- in this case, Voldemort. Therefore, 
his love of Voldemort and his desire to see him rise are so ingrained that 
they cannot help but rise to the surface as Crouch Jr. speaks, even if he 
speaks hypnotically and emotionlessly. They are as factual to him as the 
TWCup and his father's murder. Therefore, even with this physical display of 
emotion, I still find Crouch to be unaware of his surroundings, the 
Veritaserum simply reeling out the "facts, as by Crouch Jr.'s perception.

Therefore, anyone under the potion has no ability to choose words, much less 
refuse to answer. It would seem obvious that Crouch Jr. would not -want- to 
answer the questions put to him, yet he does because the power of the potion 
overrides his will. There is no room for personal control.

There does, however, come an interesting side note when Winky begs Crouch 
Jr. to stop speaking (" 'Say no more, Master Barty, say no more, you is 
getting your father into trouble!' " (US hardback, 684)). The fact that 
Winky, a magical creature (though the depth of her magical knowledge appears 
to be limited only to the "powers" that house-elves hold, which are not 
expounded on greatly), would expect Crouch Jr. to be -able- to speak against 
the Veritaserum seems to go against the impression that I get. However, to 
consider the current emotional state of Winky ("shaking," "trembling," soon 
sobbing) as well as the unlikelihood of her having access to knowledge 
concerning the effects of Veritaserum (a substance strictly controlled by 
the MM), I think her continual pleas for Crouch Jr. to stop talking can be 
accredited to her personal desire to protect the Crouch family, and not from 
any Potion-related understanding.

In the end, I still wonder about the significance of different levels of 
Truth Potions. Dumbledore obviously orders Snape to fetch the strongest 
Truth Potion, (which evidences that there are less strong potions) but I 
cannot imagine what a lesser strength potion would alter about a situation. 
Obviously, if the potion will allow the individual to evade the truth then 
it fails at being a Truth Potion. Moreover, if full ability to find the 
truth is found only with Veritaserum, then what is the point of the 
existence of lesser potions?

Kivrin
(new and quite impressed with these discussions)


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