Against Evil!Lupin responses (long)

[pippin_999 <foxmoth@qnet.com>]

No: HPFGUIDX 49555

Marina said:
>> This is what gives Remus such a strong role in presenting 
the books' theme.  Of all the characters we've seen so far, he's 
the one with the most factors pushing him toward evil -- factors 
that can't be changed, that won't ever go away.  If, in the face of
all 
that, he can still make the right choices, then we can truly know 
that it's our choices rather than our circumstances that make us 
what we are.<<

But that's not what Dumbledore said. The words are, "It is our 
choices, Harry, that *show * what we truly are, far more than our 
abilities." [emphasis mine.] That is not  saying  our 
circumstances don't make us what we are. They may, but it's 
what we choose to do with what we are that's important. Harry is 
the one who doesn't let his Slytherin leanings define his 
character. Lupin, unfortunately, has twice chosen to behave in a 
most untrustworthy way. This is canon.

DeathEater!Lupin is conjecture, but perfidious Lupin is beyond 
all doubt.  He betrayed Dumbledore's trust while he was at 
Hogwarts the first time, and then betrayed Harry and 
Dumbledore both by keeping back what he knew about Black. 
Harry does not yet  realize how dire a thing this was, but Lupin 
surely must. If he is not an evil man then he is beyond doubt a 
weak and treacherous one. 

We can't have it both ways. If Lupin was sincere when he asked 
to be forgiven for thinking that Sirius was the spy, if he was 
sincere when he said that he convinced himself that Sirius was 
using Dark Arts he had learned from Voldemort to enter the 
castle, then Lupin did *not* believe there was some chance that 
Sirius was an innocent man. He did not doubt that Sirius was 
capable of murder and terrorism. He knew about Pettigrew and 
the twelve Muggles. He also knew already what the readers do 
not learn first-hand until the opening chapters of GoF: the Death 
Eaters were terrorists who had no regard at all for innocent lives, 
and would kill and torture for sport. 

They were [insert name of real-life terrorist gang] with wands.  If 
you knew one of them was trying to break into your workplace, 
would you keep back information that could protect a thousand 
innocent lives to save your own skin? Lupin chose. He 
committed an act of breathtaking selfishness,  and not all the 
Dementor-fighting lessons in the world can make up for it, IMO. 
Once you realize what the Death Eaters are, once you admit that 
Lupin thought Sirius was one of them,  can there be an excuse 
for what Lupin did?

Lupin has admitted to cowardice and thoughtlessness. But he 
has yet to say, "My selfishness could have cost you your life, 
Harry Potter,"  and until he does, I wouldn't trust him as far as I 
could throw a hippogriff. <g>


Maria said:
>>I found it rather hard to follow this thought, but I understood it 
this way ˆ correct me if I‚m wrong.

I think you‚re saying that 1. In order for a life-debt to be
created 
there must be a real threat to the life of the wizard-to-be-in-debt 
(just, just <g>), 2. There wouldn‚t be a real threat to
Pettigrew‚s 
life unless Lupin was really a murderer, i.e. a spy for Voldie and 
generally evil. <<

Er, no. Harry's life was unquestionably in danger from 
Fake!Moody at the end of GoF, and Dumbledore unquestionably 
saved it. However, no life debt has been acknowledged. So I 
think an element of jeopardy to the rescuer has to be there. I 
think the rescuer has to put him/herself in harm's way. 

I don't think there would be a life debt unless either Sirius or 
Lupin could conceivably have killed *Harry*  to get at Pettigrew. 
As we read PoA for the first time, it seems that Sirius might do 
this, but in light of everything we know now, I can't see Sirius 
killing Harry in cold blood and I don't think Dumbledore would 
believe it of him either. That would have to mean that 
Dumbledore thought Lupin might do it. 

Maria:

>>But as for Voldy saying stuff about werewolf cubs ˆ what 
happens if a female werewolf becomes pregnant ˆ from a man 
or from a wolf? Maybe you can get werewolf cubs<<

Sorry, JKR has confirmed in chat that Voldemort was lying and 
there's no such thing as werewolf cubs.

http://www.yahooligans.com/content/chat/jkrowlingchat.html
blaise_42 asks: In Chamber of Secrets, Hagrid is supposed to 
have raised werewolf cubs under his bed. Are these the same 
kind of werewolves as Professor Lupin? 
jkrowling_bn: no... Riddle was telling lies about Hagrid, just 
slandering him

FBAWTFT: "Humans turn into werewolves only when bitten"

Maria:
>>But I think that what JKR is trying to do with Lupin
is to show how prejudiced people are – how such a nice, sweet, 
kind, smart <snip> person is shunned
because of what he is for a few hours every month. If he turned 
out to be a Mighty Evil Voldemort Supporter and we all found out 
that he'd been pretending all the while, it would have been 
against JKR's philosophy, no matter what Lupin's choices were 
or were not. <<

Would it be against JKR's philosophy to show that a person who 
was once nice, sweet, smart and kind is capable of choosing to 
become evil?  If evil is truly a choice, then even nice, sweet, 
smart, kind people may sometimes choose it.

Maria:
>And yet another thought. While Fake!Moody is cool, he isn't 
really nice<

Oh, he's nice to Neville. Gives him that Herbology book. Harry 
even thinks it's something Lupin might have done.

 >>Lupin, on the other hand, *is* extremely nice,
Harry feels it, and I don't think you can fake that kind of
thing. In 
this case I'd trust my gut feeling, which is what I do.<<

Harry's gut failed to warn him about Quirrell, Lockhart, Riddle, 
Scabbers, or Fake!Moody. I don't think, despite his boast to 
Draco about knowing who the wrong sort are, that his track 
record is very good. 

Maria: 
 >>Besides, JKR said in an interview that Lupin was one of her 
favourite characters. <<

She's also said, same chat as above, that she loves them all, 
even Dudley. <g>

Pippin