NEWT Classes Question

[bluesqueak]

No: HPFGUIDX 69073

Orymai wrote:
> Okay, I'm a little confused about this.  Let's say someone doesn't 
> get an OWL or doesn't get a high enough OWL to take the NEWT 
> class.  Is there a non-NEWT class that you can take?  Like, if Ron 
> gets an A in Potions, is there a different Potions class he could  
> take that's not NEWT preparing or is he done with Potions?  Does a 
> person have to take the OWL if they take the class?

Tricky, tricky question. Because right now we don't really *know* 
the answer from canon. We just have to argue from the real life 
equivalent, which is probably the English education system that JKR 
went through.

In this equivalent, NEWTs would not be the equivalent of the U.S. 
High School Graduation certificate. They are actually a lot closer 
to Advanced Placement classes, or junior college courses. 

[I grew up in an area near a U.S. air base, so I happen to know that 
a 'B' grade or higher in an English A level (NEWT) got the students 
exemption from the U.S. college freshman class in that subject. They 
could go straight on to 2nd year college classes. ]

It's the OWLS that are actually closest to that High School 
Graduation - an A in potions would signal that Ron's completed the 
standard school potions course with a perfectly acceptable grade. If 
Ron gets an A in potions, he's done with potions. 

The only problem he would have with that is if his proposed career 
required a potions NEWT. Again, if he doesn't get the right grade, 
the usual school opinion would be that he's picked the wrong career 
and should rethink, or, he needs to retake the OWL course. Once he's 
retaken the OWL and passed it with the right grade, he could then 
take the NEWT course a year later than the rest of his classmates
(Marcus Flint, anyone?).

I think the alternative non-NEWT courses would probably be 
vocationally based, and would probably happen when a student has 
left Hogwarts. For example, we now know that becoming an Auror or a 
Healer requires years of post-Hogwarts *vocational* study.  We also 
now know that some jobs only require OWLS (muggle liason office).

Again, the English education equivalent allows for pupils to leave 
school at 16, having taken GCSE (OWLS). A lot of those pupils go on 
to vocationally orientated education outside school - rather than A 
level Chemistry, they'd take BTEC courses in Chemistry.

The A level courses assume the student is going on to even higher 
level study, probably at University level. The BTEC courses assume 
that the students don't want to go on to an even higher level, but 
are probably going to look for a job as a technician as soon as they 
finish this course. Or they may already *have* a job as a 
technician, and the course is part of their training. 

[In practice, there's quite a bit of crossover and you can often get 
into a University with a good grade on the vocational course. ]

But what this roundabout tour is saying is that Ron is probably 
finished with Potions. The OWL course probably covered everything 
about Potions that the average, non-specialist wizard or witch needs 
to know. 

The requirement for grade O for NEWT study probably signals that 
Snape is expecting *all* his students to go on to further study, 
whether as Aurors, Potions Masters, or any other job that requires 
solid potions knowledge beyond the levels taught at school. It's an 
advanced class, rather than part of the standard school Potions 
course. 

Following on from this on to the 'will Harry get the right grade for 
potions' topic:

again, we're trapped by Harry's viewpoint. Harry is likely to see 
this requirement for O grade as unfair, especially if he doesn't get 
that grade. Snape's argument is quite likely to be that *everyone* 
in his class is aiming for a career that requires *at least* Grade E 
in the NEWT. Other NEWT classes, such as Transfiguration, may 
include students who are heading for careers without such strict 
grade requirements. *His* classes include the future Healers, 
Aurors, and Potions experts, and only the kids who get grade O in 
their OWL are likely to get the grade E in their NEWT. 

Spending class time on kids with very little real chance of getting 
an E may just bring the whole class's grade average down. Thus 
ruining the future prospects for kids who could have got an E grade 
in a smaller, tighter class.

Dumbledore has obviously allowed Snape to specify grade O, and has 
apparently never overruled him when he's refused to take a lower 
graded student. This suggests that Snape has an argument with some 
validity. For all we know Snape may have hauled out a set of 
statistics from the previous Potion's teacher's results supporting 
his case. ;-)



Pip!Squeak