[HPforGrownups] SHIP: Re: Who is the boy?

Meliss9900 at aol.com Meliss9900 at aol.com
Wed Mar 26 20:02:01 UTC 2003


No: HPFGUIDX 54371

In a message dated 3/26/2003 11:30:10 AM Central Standard Time, 
fausts at attglobal.net writes:

<Here's a situation that proverb explains even more beautifully:

<"Next time there's a ball, ask me before someone else does, and not 
<as a last resort!"

One made in anger, based on the tone? That's beautiful?  <shudder> Why on 
earth could she be angry? Hmmm perhaps because she's just been accused AGAIN 
of betraying Harry.   Harry, the one she stood by when Ron was having his 
snit (jealousy . . betrayal what ever you call it).  Harry, the one that 
she's been doing her darnedest to help stay alive for 4 years. I'd be angry 
too.. . in fact if I were in her place, Ron would have hex marks in places he 
didn't even know existed!


<Hermione talking about Harry "very much" is fully and sufficiently 
<explained by Harry:

Except Harry doesn't know exactly WHAT Hermione's been saying to Krum. Krum 
didn't tell him the specifics (purposefully perhaps)? And if Harry did know 
would he be blushing ;-).  .


<"Yeah, because we're FRIENDS."

<*Viktor* accepts Harry's explanation:  Viktor, the one who knows 
<exactly how much Hermione actually talked about Harry and how much, 
<if any, she talked about Ron;  Viktor, the jealous, suspicious, 
<grumpy one.  If he can accept it, I think we should be able to 
<stretch our minds and accept it too.

Well, they are friends and at this point in time Harry's still crushing on 
Cho.   But that's besides the point, it was Hermione's possible feelings that 
we are talking about.   And she's apparently prattling on to Krum about 
Harry.   And since Viktor never mentions anything about Ron, I'd guess not 
much. Ron also never mentions anything to Harry about Krum confronting him, 
("Harry you'll never believe it.   Krum is jealous of me!   Me! Ron Weasley.) 
.. its just not something I can see Ron keeping to himself.

<A friend talking about a friend for some reason other than being 
<secretly in love with him?   Amazing, but it could happen!

A 14 year old girl talking about a male friend to her date often enough for 
said date to feel the need to confront male friend?   Could happen, yes but 
this is a girl with no close female friends to confide in either. (which is 
kinda sad in its own way) . 

<A friend giving a friend a farewell kiss on the cheek simply to show 
<support because he's been through hell and is about to go through 
<hell again?   It's not out of the realm of possibility!

I've no doubt it was meant as a supportive kiss but why JKR's need to draw 
added (its her only hit-over-the-head-with-a-beater's-bat clue) attention to 
it. It'd would have been easy enough to write:  "Bye, Harry!," said Hermione 
kissing him on the cheek" --that sounds supportive--  "Bye, Harry!" said 
Hermione, and she did something she had never done before, and kissed him on 
the cheek. -- sounds like Harry's going to be thinking and wondering why she 
kissed him this time. Stir in Krum's suspicions and a few questions might 
start forming in Harry's mind-- 

<A girl getting to know Harry well as a close friend, and not falling 
<head over heels in love with him?    Yes, even that can occur!

No one. At least not me has said that Hermione is head-over-heels in love 
with him. I don't think she's head over heels in love with *anyone* at this 
point. Its to soon for her to know anything about "love."   If H/Hr happen it 
won't be in book 5. . I'd be horribly disappointed to have them snogging in 
the Astronomy tower already. they'd be doomed, there's still way to much 
story to be told.

<JKR has given Hermione several of the little tell-tale signs that 
<writers give their audiences when a person likes a person as more 
<than a friend:  

JKR has also said that she doesn't write to a formula. .its in the inteview 
section at the Leaky Cauldron .. its an audio only.

<She seems to be jealous about Ron's crush on Fleur 
<and takes a strong dislike to the girl.  She questions Ron 
<indignantly on his preference for inviting pretty girls to the Yule 
<Ball.  She seems to feel hurt and offended when Ron doesn't ask her 
<except as a last resort.  In an extremity of temper, she demands that 
<Ron ask her to the next Ball.  She blushes a lot when talking to Ron 
<about her love life.

You seem to forget that Harry's there during all of those occurrences as 
well, maybe she's just embarrassed to be discussing her love life in front of 
the boy she talks to Krum about. And she didn't demand that he take her 
anywhere, she stated that the next time there's a ball that he not treat her 
as a 
"Well-you're-a-girl-and-I'm-desperate-so-we-can-go-together-because-no-one-els

e-would-ask-you-to-go." I hope that even if she hadn't already had a date she 
would have turned either of them down with that approach.   She doesn't 
explode at Harry because he had the sense not to draw the Wrath of Hermione 
down upon himself.   I've no doubt that had he been the one rushing into No 
Man's Land he'd be the one getting the earful.

<those are CLUES -- clues that we have seen before in thousands of 
<novels, movies, and plays.

Yep they are clues all right. Very obvious clues from a writer who seems to 
delight in planting subtle clues all over her work.   And just because 
they've been seen a thousand times before doesn't mean that the way in which 
they are being applied is the same. 


<,JKR has failed to give Hermione any of those little tell-tale signs 
<when it comes to Harry, despite clear and obvious opportunities:  She 
<seems not to be jealous about Harry's crush on Cho or take any 
<dislike to Cho.   She betrays no curiousity or interest about Harry's 
<preference or intentions for the Yule Ball, even though the subject 
<is introduced three times in her presence.  
<She shows not the slightest hint of hurt or offense that Harry never invites 
her.  She 
<never hints in any way that Harry should ask her out in the future.  
<She does not blush when talking to Harry about her love life, and she 
<does not blush or show signs of embarrassment when her name is 
<publicly linked to Harry's or when she publicly kisses Harry.  She 
<shows no trace whatsoever of any hurt or disappointment when Harry 
<firmly and repeatedly denies that she is his girlfriend.>>>>

Actually JKR hasn't failed, she's cloaked them quite nicely.  Sort of like 
the way that Snape/Quirrell seemed to be connected in such a way that it 
looked as though Snape were the guilty party. It was obvious that Snape 
wasn't guilty but not quite so obvious that Quirrell was.

All of those instances of blushing ect you quote also took place when Harry 
was there. As for her not being hurt over his denials. She sounds hurt to me 
with her "just ignore it/them."  And she knows (in the all encompassing way 
that students at Hogwarts seem to know everything) that Cho/Cedric are a 
couple, she's too practical to be jealous of an apparently established couple
 
<These are clues as well -- negative clues.   Clues to tell us that 
<Hermione *doesn't* like Harry that way.  Clues that they are indeed, 
<as JKR plainly said, "very platonic friends."

There's also an interview/article where it states that Harry will begin to 
get more interested in Hermione. I need to look that one up again.  JKR also 
has stated that she plans things out but leaves room for changes AND that 
Book 5 would be about POA length (I'm glad that changed.  .I like long 
books!)  

<It seems to me that to maintain otherwise is the result of a stubborn 
<romanticising and eroticising impulse.>>>

Or perhaps its just a stubborn ability to see though the obvious and into the 
subtle  . . . .something that's definitely a blessing with JKR's writing 
style.   I admit when I first read all 4 books in March of last year (hey I 
just realized its been a year to the week) I definitely saw R/Hr, then on 
reading them I began to compare the way that she's foreshadowed them to the 
way that she foreshadowed everything else major and its just doesn't mesh 
with the writing style she's shown thus far.  


Melissa . . what's wrong with romance and eroticism.   



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