Question about Narcissa and the DEs

[Tom Wall]

No: HPFGUIDX 56882

Elisabeth wrote:
It seems very clear that Narcissa Malfoy is not a Death Eater. But 
there ARE some married couples that are both members of Voldie's 
circle. Why Lucius, but not Narcissa? Is it possible that she 
doesn't approve? Remember, she was the one who wanted to keep Draco 
out of Durmstrang--ostensibly because it was too far away, but what 
if the real reason was that she didn't want him to attend a school 
so immersed in the Dark Arts?

I reply:
I totally agree with you about Narcissa, and think that the most  
she's technically guilty of, as far as we can tell, is associating 
with the rest of her family.

Well, okay, we have GoF Ch.9, where Draco is hiding in the woods 
while that hooded group of wizards was torturing the Roberts family 
after the Quidditch World Cup. And Draco doesn't *deny* that his 
parents are in that group of wizards. He says: "Well... if they 
were, I wouldn't be likely to tell you, would I, Potter?" (GoF, 
Ch.9, 122, US edition) So, she *could* be there, I guess.

What's I find to be most enigmatic about Narcissa is that, as you 
pointed out, she's the one who made sure Draco didn't go to 
Durmstrang. 

>From GoF, Ch.11, 165, US - I added numbers before the major points 
in the paragraph:

"...Father actually considered sending me to Durmstrang rather than 
Hogwarts, you know. 1) He knows the headmaster, you see. Well, 2) 
you know his opinion of Dumbledore - the man's such a Mudblood-
lover - and 3) Durmstrang doesn't admit that sort of riffraff. 4) 
But Mother didn't like the idea of me going to school so far away. 
Father says 5) Durmstrang takes a far more sensible line than 
Hogwarts about the Dark Arts. Durmstrang students actually learn 
them, not just the defense rubbish we do...."

So, we know that the conversation about Draco going to Durmstrang 
involved at least five points:

1) Lucius knows Karkaroff.
2) Lucius doesn't like Dumbledore.
3) Durmstrang doesn't admit muggleborns.
4) Narcissa thinks it's too far away.
5) Durmstrang students learn the Dark Arts.

I think it's really weird that Draco doesn't talk about his family's 
long tradition of being in Slytherin House. Oh well - maybe it was a 
factor, and maybe not. But out of all of the points that we do have, 
it's point 4 that wins the day? Distance?

The other four points are major, I think. They're ideological.

They're at least bigger factors than the distance to the school, 
which seems like such a cop-out excuse, especially for people who 
can use Portkeys and Floo Powder to travel. Given the context we 
have for the Malfoys, it probably *should* have been more important 
for Draco to study with Karkaroff, away from Dumbledore, without 
muggleborn students, and be learn ingthe Dark Arts, right? You'd 
think all of that'd outweight the distance factor alone, wouldn't 
you? 

So, it's too far away?

That's is *so* lame. That was Narcissa's big bargaining chip? *She* 
won?

Aside from Hagrid and the Weasleys, who constantly group the family 
*together* as 'bad news' or as 'part of Voldemort's inner circle,' 
or 'some of his most loyal supporters,' we don't actually have proof 
that Narcissa done or been associated with anything evil at all.

She's got no mention in the Graveyard, and she's definitely not 
standing silently with her husband, because he's got Wormtail on his 
left, and the space, "wide enough for two people, that separated 
Malfoy and the next man." (GoF, Ch.33, 650, US) The Lestranges, to 
whom Sirius refers as "a married couple," in GoF Ch.27, should be in 
that space. And beyond the two-person space, the "next man," and we 
don't find out who that is.

We don't have canon on the existence of Mmes. Goyle, Crabbe, and 
Nott, and certainly not on whether or not they're all Death Eaters 
along with their 'husbands.' Technically, we don't even have enough 
canon to establish that Messrs. Goyle, Crabbe, and Nott in the 
circle are even the fathers of the students by the same names. There 
could be any relationship there, or even possibly none at all.

Oh, and one more thing. Dobby. We do have Dobby on record: "Dobby 
could tell Harry Potter his old masters were - were - bad Dark 
wizards!" (GoF, Ch.21, 381, US)

Does Draco count as a 'master?' He never mentions Dobby, ever. Does 
Narcissa count? I'd say yes, along with Lucius - the couple. Draco 
is probably included in that, but Dobby doesn't say that they're 
Death Eaters, just that they're Dark Wizards. And to be super-
technical, the 'bad' might not necessarily be derived from 
the 'dark,' in other words, 'bad' might be an independent adjective 
meant to refer to behavior like kicking him out the door and down 
the hall. After all, simply using Dark Magic isn't enough to qualify 
one as an 'evil' wizard, and certainly not as a Death Eater.


Elisabeth wrote:
My friend offered up an interesting suggestion: what if becoming a 
Death Eater is invitation only? Perhaps Narcissa didn't receive an 
invite?

What do y'all think?

I reply:
I think that your friend is right. I don't see how you could just 
sign-up or purchase a membership or anything. There's no canon for 
how you become a Death-Eater. But it seems that there is probably a 
big difference between being a 'supporter' and being a 'Death 
Eater.' 

For instance, we know that "Every Death Eater had this sign burned 
into him by the Dark Lord. It was a means of distinguishing one 
another..." (GoF, Ch.36, 711, US) I can't see this as being the same 
as being one of Voldemort's 'supporters.' I bet that the giants and 
the dementors don't have the Dark Mark burned into their left 
forearms.

I have to use an assumption here. Based on the way that Voldemort 
called the people in the circle to him in GoF, Ch.33, I'm assuming 
that everyone in the circle has the Dark Mark.

So, based on these people and Voldemort's own discussion of his 
methods, we can tell that he has used four major ways of acquiring 
support for himself:

1) True loyalty, exemplified by Barty Crouch Jr. and the dark haired 
lady from the Pensieve.

2) Imperius Curse, of which we've seen only Barty Crouch Sr. in GoF. 
We find out that Voldemort himself used this curse on Crouch in GoF, 
Ch.35: "My father was placed under the Imperius Curse by my master." 
We're also *told* that the Malfoys claimed to have been bewitched. 
In PS/SS Ch.6, Ron says "They were some of the first to come back to 
our side after You-Know-Who disappeared. Said they'd been 
bewitched." As far as we know, Crouch Sr. doesn't have the Dark 
Mark. Malfoy apparently does. So, I'm not sure that I'm convinced 
that people who're simply under Voldemort's control would have the 
Dark Mark. They could, to be fair, but it seems unlikely to me.

3) Threats/Pain/Fear, as with Pettigrew: "I never meant it to 
happen... He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named forced me -" (PoA, Ch.19) and, 
apparently, as with the use of the Cruciatus Curse on Avery GoF, 
Ch.33. Both of these guys seem to be cooperating out of fear, and 
I'm guessing that they both have the Dark Mark.

4) Promises, as with, interestingly enough, Pettigrew and the silver 
hand: "Lord Voldemort rewards his helpers" from GoF, Ch.33, and also 
with Macnair: "Lord Voldemort will provide" also in GoF, Ch.33. 
Again, both would appear to have the Dark Mark.

I think it's safe to say that, through one or combinations of more 
of these methods, this is how that group of people in the circle, 
the Death Eaters, got to be there.

Which of Voldemort's methods of acquiring support applies to Lucius? 
To Narcissa?

It's also clear to me that Voldemort, outside the circle of Death 
Eaters, has a large group of 'supporters,' as well. The Giants and 
Dementors, for instance, I think of as 'supporters,' although 
Dumbledore suggests that their support was bought:

On the dementors:
"They will not remain loyal to you, Fudge. Voldemort can offer them 
much more scope for their powers and pleasures than you can!"
(GoF, Ch.36, 707, US edition)

On the giants:
"<snip> Voldemort will persuade them, as he did before, that he 
alone among wizards will give them their rights and their freedom!"
(GoF, Ch.36, 708, US edition)

Yet, after the Quidditch World Cup, in GoF, Ch.9, we see a strange 
progression of events when the Robertses are being tortured:

First: "A crowd of wizards, tightly packed and moving together with 
wands pointing straight upward, was marching slowly across the 
field. <snip> Then [Harry] realized that their heads were hooded and 
their faces masked." (GoF, Ch.9, 119, US)

I think of this group as Death Eaters.

Then: "More wizards were joining the marching group, laughing and 
pointing up at the floating bodies. Tents crumpled and fell as the 
marching crowd swelled." (GoF, Ch.9, 119-20, US)

I don't think that the people joining the original group are Death 
Eaters - because they are not hooded and masked, and because they're 
not actually participating in the torture of the Roberts family, 
because they're really more enjoying the show, I think of them as 
just 'supporters.'

And then: "The crowd beneath the Roberts family was larger than 
ever; they could see the Ministry wizards trying to get through it 
to the hooded wizards in the center, but they were having great 
difficulty." (GoF, Ch.9, 120-21, US)

By the final quote, I'd say that what we see is a huge crowd of 
people, with the Death Eaters at the center, and their 
many 'supporters' surrounding them. I assume that Lucius, if he's 
there, would be in the center. 

Is that where Narcissa would be?  Might she be in the outer group? 
Is she there at all? Remember, Draco doesn't confirm it.

What's more alarming is that the crowd sounds so big... big enough 
for the outer crowd of people to effectively insulate the tight 
group that is masked.

Does this mean that Voldemort has far more support than we think he 
does? Based on what was going on, you'd think that everyone would 
understand that the hooded and masked wizards were Death Eaters. 
Looks like a great many people, or at least, a great many more than 
I originally thought buy into muggle torture.
 
So, as far as whether membership to the Death Eater circle proper, 
as in, the people who have the Dark Mark on their arms, 
is 'invitation only' goes, I'd say yes, definitely. 

I've even heard conjecture that the Dark Mark is something that has 
to be 'earned,' which isn't canon, but is deliciously evil and an 
idea replete with possibilities. But I don't think that 'invitation 
only' applies if we're talking about who simply supports Voldemort. 

Supporters, the way I look at it, wouldn't necessarily be privy to 
all of the inner-workings and agenda of the Death Eater circle. 
They're not the planners, or even the soldiers, but the crowd that 
won't actively try to stop what's going on, the crowd that'll just 
let it happen, even encourage it and the crowd that would be willing 
to help you out, if you needed it. 

I think that we can expect the supporters, at some point, to do more 
than sit around and watch - they'll participate too, by the end.

-Tom