Snape and Harry WAS Re: Pensieves objectivity AND: Dumbledore's integrity

[mochajava13]

No: HPFGUIDX 79837

> Melpomene
> Silly me insisting that my own children address their own 
> teachers by their titles starting on the very 1st day of school. 
> Silly me for Never, ever (are you listening, Sirius?) using the 
name 
> I used for my son's 2nd grade teacher in private or among other 
> parents of children in that witch's class to pass my lips in a 
> child's presence.

Sarah:
Well, it's not so much that Harry has to address Snape 
as "Professor" or "Sir".  All the adults excpet Sirius remind Harry 
to call Snape "Professor Snape" whenever Harry calls him Snape.  
(Lupin, Molly, Dumbledore all do this at least once.)  It's that 
Snape makes Harry call him Professor/Sir all the time, like he's at 
boot camp or something.  Harry didn't call him "Snape" to his face; 
Harry asked a question without addressing him at all.  Snape seems 
like a drill sergeant at boot camp, or a teacher at a military 
academy.  It's inappropriate at Hogwarts.  And I don't understand 
why so many adults intist on calling other adults by a name a child 
would use in front of children.  When the adults know each other on 
a personal basis, that is.  Like a mother refering to her husband 
as "Daddy."  My grandfather calls my grandmother "Mom" all the time 
in front of us grown-up kids.  Bugs me no end.  My parents call 
their sibilings by their first names, and I still call them 
aunt/uncle.  


> Melpomene
> No, no NO! You know what? If my son (13) had come home whining 
that a 
> teacher had tossed him (physically) out of his office, I'd ask 
> him "What did YOU do to deserve that?"
> But this is likely generational. When I was in school if we got in 
> trouble we got in trouble again, worse, at home. 

Sarah:
Hmm, it must be generationsal.  I'm a young adult, no children.  
(The idea of having kids frightens me right now.  I'm engaged, and I 
still have cold feet over the whole marriage thing.)  However, my 
parents would have been at the principal's office, demanding that 
the teacher explain his actions.  (OK, at least my mother would 
have.)  


> 
> A medicine cabinet is not a diary--and a pensieve is in my mind a 
> diary squared.
> Inexcusable. Absolutely inescusable. I blame Dumbledore, quite 
> honestly. Harry'd never seen a Pensieve before he snooped in DDs. 
It 
> should have been explained then (to the little idiot) that SOME 
> people MIGHT consider them PRIVATE.

Sarah:
Hm, I've always equated a pensieve with a diary.  Some people could 
care less if someone reads their diary, others flip out.  But, in 
this instance, Snape made a point of taking out the pensieve, 
removing some thoughts from his head, and transferring them to the 
penseive, in front of Harry.  That's like taking out a diary in 
front of another person, writing something in front of them, and 
then putting it away.  I would definitely wonder what that person 
wrote, and be peeved that said person wrote something in front of 
me.  I would assume that it was about me.  And I would feel that 
said person was taunting me in a sort of I-know-something-you-don't-
know.  I wouldn't have looked in the diary now, but...  And hey, 
lots of parents snoop around their children's rooms and diaries.  
Yes, Harry should not have looked into the penseive, but Harry knew 
that when he did it.  However, that doesn't excuse Snape's behavior 
afterwards.  Also, Snape hasn't always behaved appropriately in 
front of Harry.  He almost dueled with Sirius in front of Harry; 
Harry had to stand between the two.  Sirius didn't jump up and 
threaten Snape; Snape responded.  Neither Sirius nor Snape have 
exactly been appropriate in front of Harry.  And Snape talks about 
James in front of Harry; always bad-mouthing James in front of 
Harry.  Completely inappropriate.  

In my opinion, the only one of that generation that has always been 
appropriate in front of Harry is Lupin.  Lupin knew Harry's parents 
extremely well, but is the only one of that generation that seems to 
understand that Harry is not a duplicate of his father.  And Lupin 
is the only one of that generation that seems to understand that 
just because he knew Harry's parents, that doesn't mean that he 
knows Harry.  Lupin, on several occassions in PoA, makes an attempt 
to act like more than a professor and more like a family friend, but 
restrains himself.  He's even civil to Snape.  He also waits for 
Harry to come to him, not the other way around.  Lupin obviously 
cares for Harry, but he keeps the relationship between the two 
appropriate.  Not like Sirius' brotherly relationship, or Snape's 
rivalry.  Much more like a father-figure.  I really, really hope 
Harry and Lupin have a closer relationship in future books.  (Lupin 
does show Harry slightly more affection than he shows the other 
students; he claps Harry on the shoulder when he just shakes 
everyone else's hand.)  Sorry about the little side track on Lupin.  
He is, by far, my favorite adult character.  

 
> Melpomene
>He should NEVER, EVER have used 
> that name in front of Harry. If you argue that point I'm going to 
go 
> tell my son what I called his 2nd grade teacher while he wasn't 
> around.


Sarah: I think that's givig Harry too little credit.  Harry knows 
that they knew each other at school, and knows that Sirius doesn't 
call Snape "Professor" or "Sir."  Plus, Snape was in Sirius' home, 
in a non-teacher capacity.  Slightly different dynamic.  And Snape 
had just insulted James.  In front of Harry.  Neither of the two 
showed much maturity; they almost dueled.  Harry acted much, much 
more mature than the other two and had to physically come between 
the two.  If I had to restrain my teacher and my parental figure, I 
would think that we've crossed the normal teacher/student boundary.  

None of the adults refer to Dumbledore as "Professor" either, even 
though they all probably had Dumbledore as a professor/head master.  
Molly and Arthur call each other by their first names in front of 
the children.  

Also, in the Occulmency lessons, Harry seems to try to get to know 
Snape on a more friendly basis, but Snape squashes that straight 
away.  Harry tries to ask Snape questions; Snape is so, well, Snape-
ish about answering them.  Harry tried to apologize after the 
penseive incident, or at least answer Snape's accusations.  Snape 
wouldn't let him get a word in edgewise.  And Snape has Harry tell 
people that Harry's taking remedial potions.  How petty.  Could have 
just said that Harry was coming in to ask questions for the OWLs or 
something like that.  Or even given Harry detentions in front of a 
load of people as a pretext for the Occlumency lessons.  Harry, like 
Hermione, didn't appreciate that Snape had to keep treating him, and 
Neville, like slime in front of everyone else to keep up 
appearances.  Harry seemed to expect a more neutral environment in a 
one-on-one basis, but alas, not really.  Although the two were 
making headway before the penseive incident.  Oh, well.  

Sarah, who also likes Snape's deliciously nasty character