Snape's son at Hogwarts?!!

[koinonia02]

No: HPFGUIDX 80572

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "greatlit2003" Message 77832

> "There were only two other people who seemed to be able to see 
>them [the thestrals]: a stringy Slytherin boy standing just behind 
>Goyle was watching the horse eating with an expression of great 
>distaste on his face, and Neville..." (OoP, US hardcover, 445)

>"Snape-the-teenager had a stringy, pallid look about him..." (p. 
>640)
> 
> JKR doesn't use the word "stringy" too often. (I don't recall 
>seeing that word in the book series before, if anyone *has* seen 
>it, please let me know). So when she uses it twice in the same 
>book, I am suspicious.
> 
> The boy wore a disgusted expression on his face. For me, this is 
>an important clue, because JKR repeatedly mentions Snape's habitual 
> sneers and smirks. If Snape has a son at Hogwarts, his position as 
> a character will completely change. Perhaps he is not a spy for 
> Dumbledore out of a sense of honor. Maybe he wasn't in love with 
> Lily, or have some kind of vendetta against Voldemort. Perhaps > 
he's  just trying to protect his kid.

"K"

Whether or not any of us agree on whether that boy is
the son of Snape, I think there is something that
drives Snape and that is what we need to figure out. 
I just commented about this on the thread about Snape being the 
father of Ginny.

Snape seems to be either driven by revenge and/or because
he has something to gain with the defeat of Voldemort.
Hence, he isn't 'too nice' according to JKR. In other
words, don't think Snape's motives are because he is
some good and sweet guy. He's in this for his own
personal reasons. (That's just one explanation I can think of for 
Snape being not 'too nice').

greatlit:
> Snape became a spy for DD circa 1980. I had previously assumed 
>that this was somehow connected to Harry's birth in 1980. But what 
>if it wasn't? If Snape's own son was born in 1980, he had a reason 
>for stopping the violence. Maybe he had witnessed atrocities 
>against other families, and he didn't want his own son mixed up in 
>that. The possiblities are endless. And it also accounts for 
>Dumbledore's trust in Snape. DD knows that Snape would never betray 
>him, because by doing so he would be killing his own son.

"K"
That could definitely be it. *DD knows that Snape would never betray 
him, because by doing so he would be killing his own son.* That 
could be a very big reason for D's trust in Snape. I can't believe 
all Snape had to do was tell Dumbledore he changed his mind and now 
wanted to join the good side. 


> As for Snape's hatred for James, I have a feeling that the 
>mysterious Florence was Snape's girlfriend, and maybe James killed 
>her in his work for the Order. Maybe the boy witnessed his mother 
>die, which is why he can see thestrals?

"K"
Wouldn't that be something. Don't know if I believe it yet...

Now I do think Snape could have a vendetta against Voldemort even if 
it was James that was responsible for the death of Snape's wife.

Let's say Snape does indeed have a son at Hogwarts the same age as 
Harry. Here is the child of a man you hated. The famous Harry 
Potter. Snape has to teach this kid while he also has to teach his 
own child but can't even let on that he has a child. Follow that ;-)
The kid doesn't know.

Let's go back to when Harry first came to Hogwarts. I think we have 
to remember the hatred Snape seems to have for Harry. I know there 
has been talk of how Snape must appear to hate Harry for a number of 
reasons and I'm not discounting that at all. I just think it's 
possible that Snape did truly hate Harry when he first showed up at 
Hogwarts. I believe there is some reason for Snape's hate that we 
haven't found out about yet and we see that by Hagrid's reaction to 
Harry after Harry says Snape seems to really hate him.
......................................................
SS, Ch 3, Sch, pg 141
Harry told Hagrid about Snape's lesson. Hagrid, like
Ron, told Harry not to worry about it, that Snape liked
hardly any of the students.
"But he seemed to really hate me."
"Rubbish!" said Hagrid. "Why should he?"
Yet Harry couldn't help thinking that Hagrid didn't
quite meet his eyes when he said that.

pg 142
And did Hagrid know something about Snape that he
didn't want to tell Harry?
......................................................

What was it that Hagrid couldn't or wouldn't tell
Harry? Would it matter if Hagrid had said that Snape
loved Lily? Would that really be such a big secret? The
only way I could see that being so important is if
Snape only wanted Lily and didn't care if James and
Harry died. Yet that still wouldn't explain why Snape
hated Harry unless Snape was ticked that Harry lived
and Lily died. But would this still be affecting Snape
so much? Is Snape mad because Voldemort went back on
his word and didn't spare Lily? I suppose that is
possible but I can't believe that is what is still
driving Snape after all these years. It would seem to
be revenge or that Snape still has something to gain or a
combination of both.

Snape loving Lily and therefore all his actions revolving around 
that unrequited loved is a red herring. I can't see Lily as the 
reason that Snape joined the DE's and as the reason he left them.
There's something else out there. Something that affected him in a 
far bigger way and that still drives him to this day. That is why I 
like this theory so much. It puts Snape in a far different light 
than what we have seen so far. 

greatlit: 
> If the boy is Snape's son, one might wonder why he isn't good 
>friends with Malfoy, who clearly likes Snape? Maybe Snape has 
>chosen not to tell anyone that the boy is his, because he is afraid 
>that someone might harm him. The boy himself might not know.
> Maybe Snape would like to teach DADA so badly because he wants to 
> teach his own son how to fight, without anyone suspecting that the 
> two are related.
> 
> Why doesn't Snape raise his own son? Maybe he's just afraid that 
>he will be a bad parent like his own father was. He may not want 
>his son to inherit his reputation and get picked on. More 
>importantly, he may not want Voldemort to know he has a son, in 
>case Voldemort wants to recruit him into the Death Eaters, or 
>people like Malfoy try to befriend him. (I think that Snape 
>dislikes the Malfoys deep down).

"K":
I also believe Snape doesn't like Lucius Malfoy and possibly looks 
upon Lucius as someone who took advantage of him. Snape joins the 
DE's and then realizes it's not exactly what he thought it was. But 
once a DE there seems to be no way out.

OoP/Ch 2
"Well, you don't just hand in your resignation to Voldemort. It's a 
lifetime of service or death." 

So what is Snape to do? It seems one way or another his goose is 
cooked. But Snape can see to it that his child has a chance. Notice 
that Snape is the hardest on Harry and Neville, the two boys
that are connected with the Prophecy. Snape needs those boys to be 
able to defeat Voldemort. He's doing his best to get them ready. One 
might not agree with his methods but he is preparing them. (I think 
it will be Harry who has to defeat Voldy but that's for another 
thread). Snape wants Voldemort gone. It's the only chance his son 
has of living a somewhat normal life. (Personally, I don't see how 
Snape or a son could ever live a peaceful life). I imagine there 
will always be some disgruntled DE lurking around. Including Lucius 
Malfoy. Malfoy has to go also. Snape will see to that.

greatlit:
 
> Does anyone else think it's crazy that although there are only 
>twenty kids in Harry's Potions and Care of Mag. Creatures class(the 
>same kids too, year after year), and Harry still doesn't know their 
>names? We only know Harry, Hermione, Ron, Dean, Neville, Seamus, 
>Parvati,Lavender, Draco, Crabbe, Goyle, and Pansy. What about the 
>other eight?

"K"

Let's go back to the scene you first mentioned. I believe you forgot 
an important part. 

OoP/Ch 23

"Oh, an' here comes another one!" said Hagrid proudly, as a second 
black horse appeared out of the dark trees, folded its leathery 
wings closer to its body, and dipped it's head to gorge on the 
meat. "Now...put yer hands up, who can see 'em?"

Immensely pleased to feel that he was at last going to understand 
the mystery of these horses, Harry raised his hand. Hagrid nodded at 
him.

"Yeah...yeah, I knew you'd be able ter, Harry," he said 
seriously. "An you too, Neville, eh? An'___

"Excuse me," said Malfoy in a sneering voice......
*******************************************************

An'___

Well Hagrid doesn't get to name the Slytherin stringy and pallid boy 
who can see a thestral because JKR has Malfoy opening his big mouth 
at the wrong (or right) time. Why aren't we told his name? 

greatlit:
> But I digress.
> 
> Any thoughts about this?
> 
> greatlit2003
> Snape Daddy: name has a nice ring

"K"
I think Snape Daddy does have a nice ring. It would explain so 
much.  

I'm not sold on this theory 100% but I do believe you made some 
great points.

"K"