Harry v. Tom (was: LV never loved anyone)

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 110517

SSSusan earlier :
> "So why didn't he *choose* to deny that?  He did not *have* to 
> follow Slytherin's path."
 
Del answers :
> Deny it in exchange for *what* ???
> Tom was the epitome of the Nobody when he arrived at Hogwarts. He 
> had no family, no home, no history. All he had was a name. He had 
> no *identity*. And then suddenly he discovers that he is Someone. 
> Not just anyone, but the Heir of the legendary Slytherin 
> himself !! 

SSSusan:
He's also learning that he could be Someone in the context 
of "normal Hogwarts school life" too.  A respected student, a 
leader.  There's power in THAT, too.


Del:
> Now imagine someone who would be hurting emotionally as much as 
> Harry *most of the time*. 

SSSusan:
But, see, at the point of entry to Hogwarts, I think Harry WAS 
hurting most of the time.  He had no memory of his parents at that 
time; he had no input about what they were like.  The Dursleys hated 
& resented him, treated him like a servant or worse.  He WAS hurting 
most of the time.


SSSusan earlier:
> "if Tom was able to act the part of law-abiding citizen, 
> responsible young adult, so well as to attain Prefect & HB status, 
> then he DOES understand right vs. wrong!!  He is choosing to do 
> what he wants; he isn't fighting those "id" impulses at all.  

Del replied :
> I couldn't disagree more with your first sentence. Tom was able to 
> act the part of the good kid because he was intelligent, not 
> because of any moral belief.   ...
> Look at it this way : an actor doesn't have to live his character's
> life in order to portray him with credibility.

SSSusan:
I didn't say moral belief; I said moral *understanding*.  The actor 
would have to *understand* in order to credibly play the role, and 
imo full understanding IS enough to mean choice is present.  It's 
still your prerogative to disagree with me, of course.  We're not 
GETTING anywhere in the convincing department with this, are we?  At 
this point I'm merely attempting to clarify my position.


Del:
> I agree that DD might have tried to help him. But Tom would have
> resented this help very much, both because he was a teenager (even
> Harry refuses DD's help more often than not) and because he was a
> psychopath. DD's talk of love and relationships (or whatever) would
> have made no sense to Tom.

SSSusan:
That seems like a *bit* of a stretch.  If Tom encountered someone 
who finally took an interest in him, he'd resent it?  While Harry 
was thrilled?  I don't see that that's a given, though it's 
possible.  


Del: 
> And please Susan, don't get into troubles at your workplace 
> because of this discussion ! It's not worth it !!

SSSusan:
:-)  Thanks.  Tomorrow I pledge to be a more faithful, upstanding 
worker!

Siriusly Snapey Susan