Hopefully it's not that simple (was: LV never loved anyone)

[slgazit]

No: HPFGUIDX 110654

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "cubfanbudwoman"
<susiequsie23 at s...> wrote:

> Del replied :
> > But don't you believe that people, especially kids, can make wrong
> > decisions without realising they are wrong ?

There is no evidence to suggest that Riddle has made any "wrong"
choices (that is, criminal actions) before deciding to set the
basilisk on students. This was done at age 16 - when one should know
right from wrong. At 11 he chose to join Slytherin house, but this in
itself does not constitute a crime. A quarter of Hogwarts students are
 in Slytherin and most, I am sure, are not evil.

Riddle's quest to find the Chamber of Secrets could have been due to
curiosity about his famous anscestor - completely understandable.
Somehow I don't believe that the sole purpose of that chamber was to
hold a basilisk (the plural "Secrets" implies there was more than one
mystery associated with that place). It is possible that something
else that he discovered there was the final trigger to set him up on
his murderous path (perhaps another prophecy?). I really hope that JKR
will feature the Chamber again, so this question can be answered...

> SSSusan:
> NOW we're getting somewhere, Del!!  Yes, we both want there to be 
> MUCH MORE to what JKR has told us about Tom & Voldy, because if there 
> isn't, it doesn't yet make total sense.  Psychopath... evil... never 
> loved anyone... possibly never knew love... wrong choices [tactical 
> or moral, thank you Pippin]....  While intriguing, it's hard to put 
> *all* these pieces together into a complete, sensible package that 
> satisfies people's understandings of psychopathology, emotional & 
> moral development, and free will.

A central moral theme in the series is Dumbledore's statement to Harry
in book 2 that (paraphrased) "it is not our abilities that define who
we are, it is our choices". The point is that regardless of what he
has been through, Riddle made the choice to become evil, he had other
options at different points of his life, but he repeatedly took the
evil path.

In any fantasy series I have seen where there is a central conflict
between the hero and some evil dark lord (why are they always "dark" I
wonder... :-)), the evil person/god is incapable of love or
compassion, but only cares about power. This does not diminish their
stature - it makes them more scary because you cannot turn them to
good nor appeal to their human side, as they lack normal human
emotions. JKR appears to follow the same path in her depiction of
Voldemort.

> FINALLY, I think we're at the point where we've found common ground 
> in this.  What Del said about hoping JKR didn't mean things that 
> simply, and what Pam said about Tom/Voldy *having* to be seen as 
> having chosen his path or else he's just pitiable and not diabolical 
> are actually in agreement, I think.  We need more explanation from 
> JKR so that this all fits with what we know about emotional 
> development, moral judgment, psychopathology, etc.

Of course Riddle/Voldemort chose his path. I did not see the original
quote - did JKR say he "never loved" or "never experienced love"? I
think it was the former. He could have been loved by someone and not
been able to return back the feeling. Voldemort is aware of one very
strong love that affected him directly. His mother, presumably the
then last descendent of Slytherin, went against the Slytherin legacy
completely: lived in a muggle village, fell in love with a muggle,
then married him. Voldemort was born because of the love of his
mother. Note that when he mentions her (in books 2 and 4 both), it is
with respect. He saves his hatered to the father. He does not blame
her for loving a muggle, does not even call her a fool for doing so.

> And here's the kicker for me:  I *trust* JKR to be able to do this.  
> So far she's done precious little with the books to disappoint me, 
> and I'm going to move merrily along on my way, believing that Tom did 
> CHOOSE to some degree, because I think it's *not* as simple as the 
> things JKR has fed us so far and that she will fill in the gaps to 
> make it understandable.  (Please!!)

Since choice is so central in her books, I am sure the issue will be
resolved to your satisfaction... :-)

Salit