The Veil, HP & LOTR

[Silvana Roven]

No: HPFGUIDX 120857


Silvana:
>> I like to compare the characters JKR develops with
>> Tolkien's LOTR.
>> JKR herself once stated writing her books she was
>> inspired by Tolkien's work.
>>
>> I made up some ideas of who might be who, but I had
>> doubts about who is Aragorn.
>> I admit that I thought of Ron because of the
>> Quidditch-jingle "Weasley is our king". 
>> But it didn't fit that good - Ron seems more to be Sam.
>>

GEO:
> Agreed Ron does fit the Sam analogue quite well.
>
> As for the Aragorn analogue, it's Harry of course.
<snipped many similarities between Harry and Aragorn>
>

Silvana:
I see your point. But I still tend to see Harry as
being Frodo. It is Harry who has to defeat the Dark
Lord. Frodo does it by destroying the ring. And from 
what DD said and from the story itself we've learned
that (corporal) death is not really a threat to LV. So
it must be some other way to destroy the heir of
Slytherin...

Frodo inherited the One Ring from his uncle Bilbo who
was like a father to him.
Harry has only one thing, he has inherited from his
father: the INVISIBILITY cloak...

AND I dislike your comparison of the Elves to the
Dursleys. In my opinion this family is like ORCS!!!
*lol*

How about this: Sirius is from a dark wizard family
(all of them in Slytherin-House) but he grew up like a
brother to James Potter, he was in Gryffindor-House
and preferred the Potters' place.



GEO:
> Sirius is more of a Boromir analogue since both the
> first men to fall in their respective stories and 
> are both portrayed  as somewhat rash.
>

Silvana:
Yes, he is the first man to fall... on the "side of
the light". The first one JKR killed was Quirrel. And
Quirrel has been tempted by Voldemort's power - as was
Boromir.



GEO:
> He has little resemblance with Aragorn besides the
> fact that the movie characters look alike.
>

Silvana:
;-) Both didn't want to enter upon the inheritance of
their ancestors...



Silvana:
>> Rubeus Hagrid = Treebeard
>>

GEO:
> How about Radagast the Brown. I always thought that
> Hagrid was more like him than Treebeard.
>

Silvana:
Radaghast the Brown? Help me with this one, please.
Who was it? 
I imagined Hagrid as Treebeard because he is half 
giant and he was looking for the giants to join DD's
side. It looks to me like Fangorn walking towards 
Saruman. 
But maybe Treebeard would fit better to Firenze's 
part... Perhaps the centaur is able to persuade 
his former comrades to fight the dark side...



Geoff:
> I can see GEO's argument for Harry=Aragorn from the
> comparisons made but again, Harry/Ron do compare 
> well with Frodo/Sam.
>
> Harry also has to go forward and face perils on his
> own - the Basilisk for example as Frodo has to face
> Shelob. Agreed, the outcomes are not arrived at in 
> quite the same way but there are similarities.
>

Silvana:
I totally agree!
And the graveyard scene in GoF - where Wormtail takes
some of Harry's blood - could be compared to the scene
when Frodo gets injured by the dark blade on the way
to Rivendell. (I can't remember the name of this
location at the moment, sorry.)



Silvana:
>>> Peter Pettigrew (Wormtail) = Wormtongue

GEO:
>> Peter Pettigrew is NOT an analogue for Wormtongue.
>> He more closely resembles Gollum, contemptible 
>> creatures under the Enemy
>> that in the end will play an important part in
>> good's triumph over evil.

Geoff:
> Now there I would disagree with you. Both Grima and
> Peter Pettigrew have surrendered themselves to an 
> insidious and evil being and have set out to plot
> the downfall of people around them - Theoden/the 
> Potters.
>
> Gollum has become the pitiable creature that he is
> because of the erosion of his will by the Ring;
> the "two Worms" have each voluntarily allowed
> themselves to be corrupted by their evil masters.
>

Silvana:
Yes! Exactly my thinking, Geoff. :-X



Silvana:
>>> Fudge = Theoden

SR:
> I'm going to compare his role in the plot to that 
> of Lord Denethor. A figurehead, blinded by his own
> power and desire to retain it.
>

GEO:
>> Fudge is definitely not Theoden. Fudge consciously
>> refused to believe in Voldemort's return <snip> 
>> Theoden was just an old man being misled by Wormtongue.
>>

Geoff:
> That is too simple an analysis. Theoden <snip> was a
> man of great dignity, power and loved by his people 
> <snip>. It was <snip> the sorcery of Saruman that 
> brought him so low.
>

Silvana:
Fudge apologized to DD after the battle at the MoM and
finally agreed on Voldemort's return. So I hope he
will join and support DD against LV.



SR:
> I guess that would leave me comparing Arthur Weasley
> to Theoden - leaders of large, 'country folk' families
> ;)
>

Silvana:
I don't think Arthur could be compared with Theoden.
He wasn't mislead by anybody.
But perhaps Percy?!



Geoff:
> I go back though to my first point; we cannot make
> characters from each book fit the same template. 
> There is no "one size fits all".
>

Silvana:
You are right. But it is fun, isn't it? ;-)))



Alla:
> What I want to know is whether Boromir (who is my
> probably my favourite character in LOTR) will have
> similarities with Snape or not. :o)
>

Silvana:
How about Snape being the match for... Gollum! :-D JKR
describes him as an ugly person. Once he was on LV's
side (as an active DE) now he has changed sides and
helps DD and Harry. He lives in the Dungeons as did
Gollum. Ron (=Sam) hates him and doesn't trust him.
Harry (= Frodo) has learned Snape's story from the
Pensive (belongs to DD! = Gandalf) and he understood 
Snape's reactions / felt ashamed for his father.


Greetings
Silvana