Harry and the Cruciatus Curse (Re: Harry the Auror)

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 89277

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "makemeatree" <joi_foley at h...> 
wrote:
> >> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Doriane" 
<delwynmarch at y...> 
> wrote:
> 
> Del :
> We're not talking about just hurting someone. We're talking about 
> *torturing* someone. That's why the Cruciatus is an Unforgivable. 
> Harry went through it, he knows what it does, and he still wanted 
> to apply it to another human being. That shows he's got no 
compassion 
> and no self-restraint. I went through some bad things, and I sure 
> sometimes wish I could make my tormentors go through what I 
> experienced, but I wouldn't actually do it, because I know it's 
> plain WRONG. You don't make the world a better place by doing bad 
> things. And you can't make yourself feel better by hurting others. 
> Harry obviously still hasn't learned that.
> 
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Geoff Bannister" 
> <gbannister10 at a...> wrote:
> 
> Geoff:
> Come off it, Del. If Harry had no compassion or self-restraint, he 
> would have tried to go for "Avada Kedavra". He was boiling mad; he 
> wanted to get back in some way at Bellatrix but did he really, 
> really, deep down want to kill her? Maybe he said so but have you 
> never been so cross that you could do someone a serious damage or 
> smash up the crockery......
> <snip>
> "When I became a man I put away childish things..." including 
> hopefully childish emotional and uncontrolled outbursts.
> 
> 
> joi (new member, from philly, pa):
> 
> I think you have a great point Geoff, but I'd like to add 
something: 
> Bellatrix is a horrible person. She's a DE, and one of the most 
> noticable, and therefore, quite possibly, one of the worst. In LV's 
> heyday, she probably threw around Unforgivables without a second 
> thought. Harry used the Cruciatus Curse, but he used it against 
> someone who deserved it. 
> 
> I, personally, don't think Harry meant it at all. And he had every 
> reason to mean it, too- Bellatrix, as a DE, represented the arms of 
> evil that plagued the WW, the evil that killed his family, took 
> Sirius away from him TWICE, and gave him years' worth of troubles. 
> Despite that, Harry's Cruciatus didn't do much, and also warranted 
> Bellatrix's comment that he had to mean it for it to work.
> 
> Also, I think it's a very safe and fair assumption that Harry was 
> reacting to his adolescent temper. Anger's like that- it makes you 
> get all caught up in a moment. It's just another lesson he learned, 
> or is in the process of learning, really. Quite often, we see Harry 
> say and do things that upset others, and then have to work out what 
> he did wrong. As JKR was quoted as saying, "I...wanted to reflect 
the 
> fact that life can be difficult and confusing between the ages of 
> eleven and seventeen, even when armed with a wand." 
> 
> thanks,
> 
> joi.



Oh, I think Geoff and Joi said it perfectly, I just wanted to add my 
two cents.

Aren't we forgetting something here? Yes, Harry tried to use Crucio 
on Beatrix (which in my opinion she deserved and much more :o)), but 
he failed to do so, because he did not have the necessary intent.


Even in the moment of greatest pain and hurt, Harry did not have the 
intent to torture another  so called human being (Sorry, I have 
absolute zero compassion and tolerance for murderers in RL(except 
murder in self-defense) and same goes for the fictional reality too).

The main reason why Harry is my favorite character is his compassion. 
He agonizes over the fact that he will have to kill Voldemort or to 
be killed . That gives him an extra-credit in my book.


Nope, I am not worried about Harry's moral compass at all. Most of 
the time it works just fine for fifteen year old  who has been 
through a life time of misery an a lot of fighting with Evil Dark 
Lord. :o)

If he does not grasp some concepts yet ( like the fact that the man, 
who humiliated and abused him since his first day in Hogwarts, may 
have actually done a lot of brave things too, which deserve respect), 
he still has two more books to grow up and as I said, I have complete 
faith in him. :o)

Some other characters, on the other hand, are long overdue for some 
growing up. :o)


I see no foreshadowing that Harry would ever join Dark side. Didn't 
JKR said that he would not? I know, I know , just an interview. But 
although she often avoids important questions, I don't think she 
openly lied yet in her interviews.


Yes, life is often shades of gray, but I think that sometimes we tend 
to overcomplicate things. Some choices are black and white to me (and 
no, I am not that young anymore, unfortunately) and I think that 
Harry grasps many fo them just right.

Alla