List debates (was Draco's Intent)

[davewitley]

No: HPFGUIDX 101342

Darrin wrote:

> I stand by my "attempted murder" comment. It isn't that difficult 
an 
> argument, really.

I agree the argument is simple enough.  Draco believed that the 
effect of the Dementors was, in effect, psychosomatic, so that if 
Harry *believed* he was witnessing a Dementor that would be 
sufficient to make him faint and fall off his broom.  As canon 
evidence for this view you can cite some of Draco's taunting which 
gives the impression that Draco believes Harry faints from ordinary 
fear.

> Draco was clearly hoping for a repeat performance with his little 
> stunt.

Well, that word 'clearly' is the crux of this matter.  But first let 
me go back to what I think Kneasy and Pippin are saying.

As I understand it, their argument is that Draco would have 
understood well enough that the Dementors' effect on Harry is 
magical, and that therefore Harry would at most be distracted by 
Draco's act.  As canon evidence they can cite the participation of 
one of the senior Slytherin Quidditch team members, who would be 
presumed to understand this, as well as the supposition of some 
elementary foresight on Draco's part that he would be drastically 
punished if Harry were injured.

(My own position is neither of these: I tend to the view that Draco 
was criminally stupid.  If you had asked him beforehand what he 
thought would happen he'd probably look blank, IMO, and if you taxed 
him with the possibility that Harry would fall he'd shrug and 
say 'Yeah, maybe, that'd be cool, wouldn't it?  Who cares?  We'll 
have great fun making a fool of famous Harry Potter, won't we?'  My 
canon support for this is that Draco 'clearly' hadn't thought about 
the fact that there were teachers present, who could be relied upon 
to enforce school discipline and punish him.)

> Perhaps he hadn't thought the matter all the way through.

I agree.

 I'll give 
> him that, mainly because I also give Sirius that same benefit of 
the 
> doubt when it comes to the Shrieking Shack prank.

Now this makes no sense to me at all.  If you truly consider there 
is some doubt as to the nature and extent of Draco's planning, then 
Sirius is irrelevant.  The cases may be parallel, and the parallel 
may be of literary interest, but neither throws any light on the 
interpretation of the other, IMO.

> But in the end, like Sirius, Draco's behavior was incredibly 
reckless 
> and malicious.
> 
> I find that little punk indefensible.

My point here is that we are not really in the business of defending 
or accusing Draco.  I have pointed out how different aspects of the 
canon may lead one to different interpretations of Draco's 
motivation and expectations of the outcome.  But if I choose an 
aspect that lets Draco off the hook, that's not defending him, it's 
describing a slightly different Draco.

All one can say, I think, is something like 'on my understanding of 
canon, Draco intended Harry's death or serious injury.  I find such 
behaviour indefensible.'  Another list member might then say 'my 
reading is that he intended no harm to Harry beyond embarrassment 
and loss of a Quidditch match.  Such behaviour is, in my view, 
reprehensible, but not unusual in teenage children.'  All you can 
each do is cite canon support for your interpretation and hope that 
your co-debaters will be enlightened, while at the same time seking 
such enlightenment for yourself.

Of course, if somebody said 'I think canon supports the view that 
Draco intended to Harry to die.  But hey, that's kids for you - 
Draco's just being a bit exuberant and we love him for it,' you 
might well be justified in being a little surprised, and worried 
about letting that list member look after your own children, should 
such be a possibility.  However, in the first place, I don't believe 
anyone here has come remotely close to expressing such an opinion, 
and secondly, even if they did, we would still have to accept it as 
a valid reader response to the text.

Finally, it is of course possible that some list members have 
decided that they like Draco, for whatever reason, for example 
because they are cissies who like to undermine red-blooded American 
values, and then find canon doesn't support the interpretation they 
like.  They might then go back and re-interpret much of the detail 
until they have a picture they feel is consistent with their liking 
for Draco, yet morally acceptable on the list generally.  They would 
then be rather resistant to interpretations that paint Draco in a 
bad light.  It's certainly possible.  But, y'know, if people want to 
do that, it's fine with me.  We can interpret the words of the books 
how we like here.  It's probably a bad idea to try and call them on 
it, though.  My feeling is that that would be poor netiquette.  
Please correct me if I'm wrong.

David