[HPforGrownups] CHAPTER DISCUSSION: ch. 32 "Out of the Fire"

[Vivamus]

No: HPFGUIDX 118335

Nice post, Ginger 

> Previously, in "The Order of the Phoenix":

> Umbridge demands that Hermione and Harry 
> take her to it, leaving the Inquisitorial Squad to guard the others.  

Vivamus:
It still begs the question, of course, of just HOW they managed to escape
the Inquisitorial Squad.  Wandless and held by a larger number of people
bigger than they are, they must have done something pretty spectacular to
get away.   I'm guessing Luna did something typically weird and *apparently*
stupid, Neville used the chance to try to break free, creating a real
distraction, allowing Ginny to get her hand on her wand and get control of
things.

> Ginny has been noticed lying easily before.  (Telling her mother that 
> Crookshanks had been playing with Dungbombs when it was she using 
> them.)  In this chapter, she comes up with the Garroting Gas lie 
> quickly, but says it was F&G's idea.  Later, she is very convincing 
> when telling the other students about the Gas.
> 
> 1)  Do you think that F&G really intended to use what seems to be a 
> fatal substance for a prank?  Or was Ginny lying about that too?

Vivamus:
They would not, although they might well have talked about it, then come up
with a version that choked you until you passed out, then completely covered
you with iridescent purple ectoplasm.  
 
> 2)  If Ginny continues in this vein, will she be a potential asset to 
> the group?  Will she be good enough to fool LV, for example?  Or 
> another Legilimans?  Or will she be a potential liability?  

Vivamus:
I think, power-wise, she is a very close match to Harry, and way beyond
either Ron or Hermione. 
 
> 3)  This is the second time that Ginny is able to cut Harry off mid-
> pique.  (The first being when she points out that she too knows what 
> it is like to be possessed.)  Does this speak for her character?  Or 
> is it that she is someone outside the trio, so Harry is not as used 
> to her comments?  Or (I'm gonna kick myself for asking this) could it 
> have shipping implications?

Vivamus:
I think both of those are reminders that Ginny actually has more in common
with Harry than almost anyone else, not only from the close association
Harry has with her family, but from the fact that Voldemort put part of
himself in each of them.   Ginny comes across as tough, smart, funny, and
lively.  Hmm, if JKR were preparing someone to be a match for Harry, what
would she look/act like?   A pretty-but-delicate flower who can't handle
blood and guts, or someone with the sense of fun and mental toughness of
Fred and George, and courage the match of Harry's?   

When Ginny puts Harry in his place, by (1) cutting him off in mid-tantrum,
(2) being very cool when Harry treats her like a little girl, and (3)
"giving up" on Harry to have relationships with other boys, it changes her
from a doting little girl to an equal character in Harry's eyes.  Going into
the MoM to fight the DEs has to have a profound effect on all the DA members
who went.  You don't go through a life-and-death battle without being
personally changed, as well as having lifelong bonds with your friends who
fought with you.

It looks to me as if Ginny is being built up in preparation for a real
relationship with Harry.  Think about Fred and George's speaking of her with
something like awe when talking about her "bat-bogey hex."  Those two are
not easy to impress.  They treat Ron with an elder sibling's typical
contempt, but give the impression that they *really* don't want to mess with
Ginny.

I'm still waiting for it to come out that Ginny is a parselmouth. 

> 5)  Umbridge says she is going to loosen Harry's tongue with the 
> Cruciatus curse.  She is pointing her wand at Harry.  Knowing Harry's 
> tolerance for the Quill, don't you think she would have gotten the 
> truth out of him more easily by torturing one of his friends and 
> making him watch?  Or does she not understand love between friends?  
> Or did she choose to curse Harry in the hopes that one of his weaker 
> friends would crack to spare Harry the pain?  

Vivamus:
I don't thing DU was smart enough to think of that.   LV would have done it
as a matter of course -- not because he shares those emotions, but because
he despises them.  DU just wanted to torture Harry, since he was the
principal thorn in her side after DD -- and really, it was a way to get back
at DD by attacking his precious Harry.  
 
> 6)  What do you think of Snape's actions?  He managed to warn Harry 
> that she had used veritaserum on him once, which should have put 
> Harry on his guard.  He played up to Umbridge without being any help 
> whatsoever. (And got in some delightfully snarky comments as well.)  
> He saved Neville from choking with another snarky comment to Crabbe.  
> Do you think he could have given Harry a clue that he understood 
> him?  Or would that have been too risky as Umbrigde had just seen 
> through him enough to put him on probation?  

Vivamus:
I think it would have been way too risky to do anything other than he did.
Harry might well have put Snape's life in danger with that comment.  It was
pretty stupid of him to do it that way, y'know.  He could have said it
looking at the floor just as well, and no one else would have realized he
was talking to Snape.  

Now, if DU gets recruited by the DEs, LV might just learn that Harry was
telling Severus that LV had Sirius where the prophecy was hidden.  The only
reason that could possibly be is that Snape is working for the Order.

Vivamus