bullies? twins, padfoot and prongs

[Sharon]

No: HPFGUIDX 118416


Welcome - I'm new too, actually!

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Clare Durina" 
<claredurina at y...> wrote:

I cannot agree that Wormtail was a
> nice guy who went astray due to low self-esteem after years of his
> cool friends' torment. He was never nice, and just like being strong
> and talented does not make one offensive, being weak or talentless
> does not make one innocent. 


It is not that we Peter Supporters are trying to say that Peter 
Pettigrew was a fine upstanding human being.  (Well, not all of us.)  
I think what we are trying to say is that he was not always evil to 
the core.  Was he tormented by James and Sirius?  Did he have self-
esteem problems?  More than likely - otherwise he wouldn't have hero-
worshipped James and Sirius quite as much as he did.

But was he weak and talentless?  Heck no.  

Let's look at the facts here.  Peter Pettigrew did the following, 
according to canon, any way you spin it:

1. He fooled his friends into thinking he was not a Death Eater.
2. He successfully became an Animagi - even with help, this is a 
tough thing to do.
3. He killed 12 Muggles behind his back with very little pre-planning.
4. He found Voldemort in Albania without help.
5. He lured Bertha Jorkins to Voldy's lair, despite the fact that 
Bertha should have known that he was dead.
6. He gave Voldy some sort of body to exist in while waiting for the 
Final Task.
7. He brewed the potion that brought Voldy back to full power - and 
in doing so, cut off his own hand without painkillers.

Now, does any of that say "Hi, I'm weak and defenseless and really 
stupid!!!!"

Peter must have had some sort of talent if he was to brew those 
potions.  He must have had some sort of strenght if he was to kill 12 
Muggles in one blow.  He must have had some sort of (twisted) loyalty 
to find Voldy in Albania when he simply could have disappeared to 
somewhere else, and made it that much harder for Sirius and Remus to 
find him again.  He'd hid under their noses for twelve years already, 
remember - he was certainly capable of doing it again.


Claire Durina:
Why should we feel for him? Maybe too
> many of us adult HP fans were unpopular as kids and are drawing an
> illogical connection between Pettigrew and themselves. Otherwise, I
> can't see how this idea became so accepted among fans. 


Entirely possible, yes.  But most of us who were tormented as 
youngsters didn't become mass murderers.  But I do not believe that 
unpopularity causes sympathy for Peter Pettigrew - I think a profound 
understanding of the choices one is forced to make in life does.


Claire Durina:
Look in the "
> Snape's worst memory" chapter. He is detestable. First he's trying
> to cheat of his neighbor's exam, 

Not necessarily.  Yeah, yeah, I know what it looks like.  But we only 
know from Harry's viewpoint that he's trying to cheat.  Personally, I 
think Peter was just trying to figure out if he was ahead or behind - 
and a way of doing that was to see how far along his neighbors had 
gotten on their tests.  

Also, if his answer to question 42 was one sentence, but the person 
next to him had written three or four, he might go back and 
reconsider extending his answer.

I don't consider that to be cheating.



Claire Durina:
Lupin was
> cowardly, James arrogant, Sirius vicious, but Wormtail was wicked,
> psycophantic, even sociopathic. He enjoyed watching others in pain.
> He wasn't strong enough to do it himself, but he was even more
> pleased by Snape's humiliation than the others. 


Hold on.  James and Sirius weren't wicked by actually starting the 
torment?  Lupin wasn't psychophantic by allowing them to do as they 
wished, thereby silently condoning their actions?  Sirius isn't 
sociopathic by simply torturing another student simply because he's 
*bored*?!?

To say that Peter was psychophantic and sociopathic is stretching one 
moment in a lifetime to gargantuan proportions.  


Claire Durina:
JKR makes similar
> remarks about him in other places too. 


Where?  JKR has actually made very few remarks about Peter in 
public.  Generally she avoids questions about him entirely, or 
answers "Oh, I can't tell you that yet."  Most recently she has given 
reasons for us to believe that Peter will play a larger role in the 
events of HBP.  



Claire Durina:
Neville does not deserve to be picked on by snape
> or malfoy- he is unpopular and less talented, but also kind and
> brave, selfless and honest. Wormtail, although superfically like 
> Neville, has none of his good qualities. 


Oh?

Peter is loyal.  He could have run to Canada instead of Albania - 
instead, he went and found Voldy.

Peter is brave.  He stands up to Voldy, trying to convince him to go 
after a wizard other than Harry.  Can you picture Malfoy doing the 
same?

Peter is smart.  He outsmarts his friends, the Order, and most of the 
wizarding world.  He brews difficult potions and he manages to 
ressurrect the dead.

Now.

Do I think Peter and Neville are exactly alike?  No.  Peter was part 
of a group, one of four.  Neville has not been included in the Trio, 
and he has been largely excluded, it seems, from the intimacies of 
Seamus & Dean's friendship.  It is possible that Neville has been far 
more excluded and ignored than Peter ever was.  If anything, Peter 
had it *better* than Neville.

Does that alone excuse Peter for turning to the Death Eaters?  Not a 
chance.

*Why* Peter went to Voldemort I can't tell you for certain.  I can 
only give you suppositions and theories, of which there are plenty.  
But only the weakest (and admittedly least interesting) involve him 
going over purely because he was stupid, boorish, and untrustworthy.

After all...Voldemort wouldn't have wanted a servant with those 
qualities either.


--azriona, who is a long-time Peter Sympathizer, and tends to take 
him a bit too much to heart.  She hopes you forgive her for that...