Sin/Redemption & Snape / Christianity in HP

[Tonks]

No: HPFGUIDX 128319

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "AyanEva" <ayaneva at a...> wrote:
> I'll admit that I'm not a Christian because Christianity confuses 
the crap out of me, but the sin/repentence thing hardly seems fair 
or very logical. (snip)How can you act in accordance to God's edicts 
when the edicts are so terribly vague and contradictory, especially 
considering that the Old and New Testaments don't really match, 
(snip)In which case, can we even apply to Harry Potter a 
> morality and theme that not everyone will understand? Otherwise, 
> wouldn't the books come off as kind of evangelical? That doesn't 
fit with the fact that no religion is mentioned. ETC...


Tonks:
(note to elves. This goes a bit OT here and there, but gets back to 
the series before I am done, so hang in there.)

I am sure that Christianity must seem confusing to those that are 
not Christian.  There are many different threads of theology within 
the Christian Church, even within the same section of the church.  
So how can we sort out the teaching of JKR, teachings which many of 
us see as XC (Christian)? 

When you ask "How can a person like Snape or Percy, or even LV for 
that matter, be forgiven when they do not think that what they have 
done was wrong?" The answer on this list will vary with the belief 
of the writer.  However, there is a body of *canon* in CX 
(Christian) theology just as there is here. 

The Old Testament has the 10 commandments. True there are many other 
rules if you are Jewish which were observed in the Old Testament, 
but the basic ones and the ones that Jesus continued in the New 
Testament were the 10 commandments that were give to Moses.  Jesus 
said he did not come to change any of it.  He just made it 
clearer.  "Love God with your whole heart and soul and love your 
neighbor as yourself."  If you do this you will naturally be 
following the 10 commandments.

These 10 commandments are also the basis of moral truth in other 
religions as well, but they are not stated quite the same way.  One 
could say that JKR has summed them up herself in the 3 things that 
one should never do.  1. Kill  2. Force others against their will   
3. Hurt others 

All members of the WW know that these 3 curses are wrong. One could 
say that the Great Creature of all the worlds (WW, MW, RW) put this 
knowledge within each of us.  We just sort of *know*.  This is why 
in the study of world religions one sees the same basic moral 
thought.  We all, no matter what religion we follow, *know* at a 
deep level of our being. 

On the thought of XC redemption, again there are different threads 
of thought on this.  Most XC's don't know that.  There is a 
theologian called Duns Scotus, who said that the greatest thing that 
God did was to become man/human (the Incarnation). Other theologians 
say that it was the plan that Jesus would die to redeem the world.  
But not all say that.  Duns Scotus says that God became man and that 
because he was Love,  Jesus chose to follow the love in his heart 
and the will of the Father and because of this and the nature of 
mankind, the crucifixion came about.  God did not demand a 
Crucifixion, He may have seen into the future and knew that it was a 
probability, but did not say "I have to kill my son to redeem the 
world". (OK folks don't hang me here, I am only telling you about 
the theology of one of the teachers in the Roman Catholic Church in 
the 14th century.  He was never censured and his thought stands 
alongside the rest as a valid idea.  An idea that I might say seem 
more plausible to me that the "I have to kill my son" idea.  And 
that doesn't make me a heretic, so don't start firing up the 
cauldrons!!)  

How will this play out in the HP book?  I do think that JKR is 
writing about what she believes as a Christian.  I also think that 
JKR is of the Redemption school of thought, so there will be some 
sort of life freely given, probably by Harry.  Maybe by DD since his 
Patronus points to Christ.  As we get toward the end of the series I 
think that we will see it more clearly.  And a reading of the book 
of Revelation might be helpful, since I think what we will be seeing 
is the *final battle*.

Tonks_op
I am not a theologian, but do have a degree in Religious Studies. 
Anyone who wants to discuss theology or has questions about XC 
theology may e-mail me directly.

PS.  Many Christian holidays were built upon the pagan ones before 
them, but only to convert the pagan.  Many XC churches, etc. were 
built upon the ruins of pagan shrines.  Sort of the *king of the 
mountain* sort of thing.