"Magic always leaves traces..."

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 135910

> Jen wrote:
> "It also struck me that he (Dumbledore) refers to the cave as 
> Riddle's style, not Voldemort's. Either Dumbledore is once again
> refusing to acknowledge who Riddle has become, or he literally 
> means Riddle placed the locket in the cave as far back as the
> murder of Hepzibah Smith. There are moments in the cave when he
> says 'Voldemort', but in that particular instance he refers to
> Riddle."

Tina:
> Funny, I didn't read it that way. Actually, one of the things I 
> liked most in HBP (and unfortunately, I didn't like the book all 
> that much) is how it shows how and why Tom Riddle becomes
> Voldemort, and it explains the reason why Dumbledore calls
> him "Tom" when they're fighting at the Ministry in OotP. I used to
> see it as simply Dumbledore's way to taunt Voldemort, but now it
> seems there's more to it: Voldemort *is* Tom Riddle, and did not
> become something completely different. Voldemort *tried* to become
> something completely different, but failed to do so.

Jen: I did like Dumbledore's explanation that Voldemort would always 
be 'Tom' to him because he was a former student. I think there's a 
little more to it, though. Not that Dumbledore is taunting Voldemort 
by calling him Tom, but he *is* pulling a power play in his office 
when Voldemort requests the teaching position. Reminding him that at 
least one person out there is still holding a memory of Tom Riddle 
and therefore, Voldemort cannot completely extinguish his past.

As for the cave, I've decided it probably was just another instance 
of DD remembering student-Tom while examining his work. 
 
> SSSusan:
> "For surely as Riddle matured & deepened his talents, his 
> schemes & protections would have increased in complexity?"

> Tina:
> Increased in complexity, certainly, but wouldn't change. Looking 
> from this point of view, we can say that Voldemort's schemes and 
> actions are boringly predictable (to Dumbledore, at least). If 
> not, then Dumbledore's lessons wouldn't be of much use, would
> they? Dumbledore trusts that Tom's old fears and desires will
> always determine how today's Tom will act.

Jen: As Tina mentioned, I also found the most intriguing part of HBP 
was the evolution of Riddle into Voldemort. The nature/nurture 
debate definitely comes into play here, and infortunately for 
Riddle, he got the worst of both. Born to a "very ancient Wizarding 
family noted for a vein of instability and violence that flourished 
through the generations due to their habit of marrying cousins." 
(chap. 10, p. 212); Tom may look like his Dad, but he got his 
magical power and other erm, *distinguishing* characteristics from 
the Gaunts.

The characteristics of his magical ability however, spring from his 
nurturing, or lack thereof--fear, abandonment, the associated coping 
skills Riddle adopted like isolating himself and craving power. 
Dumbledore understands his pattern like no other, after all, he got 
to see it firsthand as early as age 11 before Riddle became 
completely duplicitous. 

> Jen wrote: 
> "The big question is, did Harry learn enough in the cave to 
> recognize and defeat Voldemort's obstacles surrounding the
> remaining Horcruxes? 

> SSSusan:
> This is where I don't feel good about things at all.  I'm sure
> Harry learned a lot from the pensieve episodes with DD.  I'm sure
> he learned important things from DD in the cave.  But HOW DID DD
> *DO* ALL THAT in the cave?  He just... felt things... sensed 
> things... just "knew."  That is stuff one cannot teach, really,
> and I suspect Harry was stunned & bewildered by DD's ability to do
> that just as we were.  

> Me (tina):
> I think Harry didn't learn much in the cave – the cave was
> more of an example of everything Dumbledore had told him in their
> lessons. But I do share your concern on another thing: is Harry
> skilled enough to face Voldemort's obstacles? What Dumbledore was
> doing seemed extremely tricky to me – he was recognizing every bit
> of magic Voldemort had set, and they didn't seem as "fun" – or
> as relatively harmless - as the tasks in PS. 

Jen: Likewise, I don't think you can teach Harry's ability to fly by 
the seat of his pants! But he'll *have* to have the help of his 
friends. JKR told us Dumbledore isolated himself as the price for 
being the greatest wizard of his time. I think the reason he harps 
on Harry's ability to love is because he realizes Harry's strength 
is both his ability to draw others near AND allowing them to help--a 
trait neither Dumbledore nor Voldemort share. 

Jen