The Importance of the Houses (was:Re: Slughorn a dead end topic?)

[prep0strus]

No: HPFGUIDX 137901

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "horridporrid03" 
<horridporrid03 at y...> wrote:

<snip>
> She also points out that Ron has Hufflepuff tendencies (which 
> feature in GoF), Hermione has Ravenclaw tendencies (which feature 
in 
> OotP), and Harry has Slytherin tendencies (which he brings to the 
> forefront in HBP).  So there's your appealing Slytherin. :)
> 
> I think JKR is suggesting that each house has a certain skill or 
> strength, held by each member of the Trio, that will be needed to 
> defeat Voldemort. Gryffindor bravery is certainly key, but it will 
> also take loyalty, intelligence and cunning.  Fortunately Harry and 
> Ron and Hermione form a beautifully well-rounded crew.  
> 
> (I think this is further suggested by the houses being linked to 
the 
> four elements.  Each element is necessary in maintaining a stable 
> structure.)
<snip>


Ok, I don't know how to use 'snips', and don't often respond in 
pieces to posts, because I find it more confusing, but I thought I'd 
try this time.  I certainly agree that the main characters could 
easily represent the different houses.  Neville usually comes to mind 
before Ron as a Hufflepuff, but Ron certainly makes sense, especially 
as a member of the trio.  It's Harry I find as representing Slytherin 
to be the most difficult - sure, the hat said he would do well there -
 if he was ambitious.  But Harry isn't that ambitious.  He has 
developed more of a desire to be an auror, because of his past, but I 
would still consider Hermione more ambitious than he is.  Also, Harry 
doesn't often fall into the 'cunning' category.  But, as I said 
before, neither do many members of Slytherin - Crabbe & Goyle at the 
forefront.

It's more that I don't understand the purpose of the houses if 
they're not going to represent what they're supposed to, or what the 
hat has led us to believe they're supposed to.  Gryffindor is for the 
brave, sure, so that allows characters that represent other qualities 
to be included as well.  Ravenclaws are studious and smart, and while 
we haven't seen too much studying from Luna, maybe it's just because 
we haven't seen too much of Luna in class or the Ravenclaw common 
room, but it's a pretty obvious distinction.  Hufflepuff & Slytherin 
seem to break down a bit more.  Hufflepuff is for the 'loyal', 
the 'hardworking', and the 'rest' (those not fitting into the other 3 
houses).  The first two descriptions I could accept, but the 'rest' 
leaves a bad taste.  With a cursory glance, the 4 houses could be 
described as thus: The Good, The Bad, The Smart, and The Useless.

And the 'bad', the Slytherin... that seems to be the only qualifying 
factor.  The main characteristics we've been given for them are 
ambitious, self-serving, and 'teaching those whose blood is purest'.  
That last doesn't come true - and the hat should be able to tell 
that. And the others shouldn't necessarily leave out any appealing 
people (i'll talk about that briefly below).  But Crabbe & Goyle, I 
think I'd put in Hufflepuff if it wasn't for them being 'the bad'.  
They're 'loyal', and the 'rest', if not hardworking.  But hardworking 
would leave out our Ronny as a metaphor for Hufflepuff as well.


> Betsy Hp:
<snip>
I think we 
> saw some serious signs of good Slytherins (and I love that this is 
> plural). Slughorn is an obvious choice.  Sure, he's no saint, but 
> he's no devil either.  (And frankly, the Potterverse is pretty 
> lacking in saints.  Even Dumbledore has a few warts.)  And he 
> certainly seems to be on Harry's side.  Draco is shaping up to be a 
> very good candidate, IMO.  His words with Dumbledore, his lowering 
> of his wand, his disassociating from the other Death Eaters should 
> have interesting repercussions in the next book.  And, of course, 
if 
> Snape is good, then he's very, very, good.  So there's another 
> candidate.  
> 
> Harry, himself, embraced his Slytherin side (appearently a little 
> bit of his mother in him) and found it quite useful.  He used it to 
> help Ron out with his quidditch, and he used it to get the memory 
> out of Slughorn.  
> 
> Frankly, I think Harry's own Slytherin-ness will come into play in 
> the last book as well. As will Hermione's Ravenclaw-ness, and Ron's 
> Hufflepuff-ness. Though I'm sure representatives of each house will 
> also play some sort of part, even a minor one, in hunting down the 
> Horcruxes, what with there being four horcuxes to be found and 
> destroyed.  
<snip>

Again, I've gotten myself in trouble with using the word 'good' in 
that first post.  I do believe Slughorn to be on the side of good, 
and will not be surprised at all if Snape is as well, or if Draco 
joins up.  What I mean to say, I guess, is 'appealing', though that's 
a bit subjective.  I want a Slytherin I can LIKE.  Snape, even if he 
is as good as the biggest Snape supporters believe, that from the 
moment he joined Dumbledore he has been fighting Voldemort w/ all his 
being... he's still a jerk.  Same with Draco.  And Slughorn, who is 
the 'nicest' Slytherin we've encountered, still leaves me with bad 
feelings.  All these characters may wind up being 'Good', but will 
they be 'Nice'?  Will they be characters you want to be friends with?

And while there may be real points to be made regarding Harry's 
Slytherin tendencies, Harry is Gryffindor.  If he were a Slytherin 
hero, that might be interesting.  But he's not, he's a Gryffindor who 
could have qualities that would make a good Slytherin.  And so JRK 
has yet to provide (me) a Slytherin to like.  A Slytherin that makes 
me see not only goodness, but niceness.  Slughorn may be the closest, 
and as a character, he is interesting, and I love his place in the 
books.  But that doesn't mean I would want to be buddies with him.  
Through Harry we see the self serving elitism that is exclusive, 
unkind, and distasteful.


I actually really like your answer about 'Book 7', though I tend to 
doubt I will find the kind've Slytherin I'm interested in, or the 
explination that haunts me about the houses.  I really love the minor 
characters, exploring the kids who wound up in the other houses (and 
even our other Gryffindors).  After 5, and the DA, I really thought 
we seem some serious exploring of them in HBP, and was a little 
disappointed.  I tend to doubt, with everything else that needs to 
happen, that we'll see too much of it in 7 either.  I can always look 
forward to the Encyclopedia - JKR says she has backgrounds on every 
kid in Harry's class.

~Prep0strus