[HPforGrownups] The Legend of the Lost Day

[Kathryn Jones]

No: HPFGUIDX 143810

KJ writes
snip
   Excellent post.  It brings up some interesting questions and allows 
for some different theories. I will have a shot. There is nothing wrong 
with "off the wall".

> The facts:
> 
> (i) Sometime on the evening (here meaning anytime up to midnight) of
> October 31st 1980 Lord Voldemort arrived at the Potter's home in the
> village of Godric's Hollow based on information received or
> extracted from Peter Pettigrew. 
  KJ:
   I suggest that Snape had arrived at the house prior to the arrival of 
Voldemort to warn the Potters of their danger. He believed that Sirius 
was the traitor and the Secret Keeper and stated as much to James. James 
refused to believe it and undoubtedly told Snape to get lost. He may 
have been trying to convince Lily, when Voldemort arrived, forcing him 
to leave to protect his position. Voldemort, in company with Peter, and 
perhaps other DE's, then killed James. When Voldemort entered the house, 
events played out much as you have suggested. The clues presented to 
back up this theory are:

1. Snape believed that Sirius was the traitor so he was not present with 
Voldemort during the attack.
2. Dumbledore also believed that Sirius was the traitor and would only 
have been given that information by Snape who was actively spying at 
that time. He also knew that there was a spy in the Order but not which 
person.
3. There was the comment by Snape to the effect that James was too 
arrogant to believe that his friend was a traitor, so it would seem that 
an actual warning had been made.
4. Snape would have immediately gone to Dumbledore or sent a message to 
the effect that the Potters had been attacked. This is the most likely 
way for Dumbledore to know about it.
5. I believe that Peter was there as well because he is the only person 
seen in the books who had active control of Voldemort's wand.
6. Dumbledore also knew that Voldemort was not dead, which Snape would 
have been able to tell him as well. Most of the DE seemed to know that V 
was still alive somewhere.

> (iii) Prior to aiming his killing curse at Harry Lord Voldemort gave
> Lily Potter the opportunity to save herself, which she declined. He
> then killed her and incanted the killing curse once more to kill
> Harry but was unsuccessful and the curse rebounded onto him while at
> the same time giving Harry his scar and certain powers.

KJ writes:
   There was obviously some kind of magical exchange of a life for a 
life, and possibly blood for blood, incanted non-verbally by Lily, which 
would have set up the basis for Dumbledore's later protections. 
Voldemort's killing curse appeared to have been reflected back upon the 
caster. This idea of reflection is used in the constant mention of 
Harry's appearance being just like his father's and his eyes just like 
those of his mother.
snip
> (v) The Potter's house was reduced to rubble, possibly by a third
> party or possibly as a result of the failed curse (although I prefer
> the former explanation).

KJ:
   While I really like the theory you have that the house was destroyed 
to break the Fidelius and give warning to the Order, I prefer to believe 
that it was the backlash of the killing curse multiplied by Lily's 
protective magic. As I am convinced that Harry carries a Voldemort soul 
part, the explosive nature of the rebound is a better explanation of how 
that piece seemed to be cut into Harry.

> (vi) The first person on the scene was Rubeus Hagrid who had been
> sent by Albus Dumbledore and while he was there retrieving Harry
> Sirius Black turned up on his flying motorcycle that he subsequently
> gave to Hagrid to take Harry away.

KJ writes:
   As above, I don't think that Hagrid was first on the scene. Snape may 
not have known that Harry was alive when he left to tell Dumbledore. 
There would have been a considerable explosion and people would have 
been arriving very quickly. I don't think that Dumbledore would have 
known quickly enough to set the things in motion that seem to have 
happened. Dumbledore would have been the only one to know that Harry was 
alive because of the prophesy. As JKR refused to answer any questions 
about time turners, I suspect that by the time all of our actors were in 
place, it woud have been necessary to send Hagrid back via time turner 
to retrieve Harry before he became a ward of the Muggle government. 
Hagrid's lateness could easily be explained by the necessity of 
remaining completely hidden from the view of others. Hagrid did meet 
Sirius there but as there is considerable confusion about how time 
turners work to change events, this meeting would have done little to 
change history. In the original events, Sirius may have arrived too late 
to meet Hagrid before the Muggles showed up, or he may have arrived at 
the Potter's after Hagrid had taken Harry. In this alternative time, he 
and Hagrid met, and Hagrid borrowed the motorcycle. As a result of the 
time turner, Dumbledore had much more time to set things up, get the 
protections in place, write Petunia a letter, talk to whoever he had to 
talk to at the Ministry, etc.

> (viii) Minerva McGonagall in her Animagus form spent practically all
> day at Privet Drive observing the Dursley's house and its environs
> and by the time Dumbledore later arrived had formed the conclusion
> that the Dursleys were not good Muggles.

   KJ:
    To me it is impossible for Dumbledore to have told Hagrid near the 
time of the attack on the Potter's that he would be going to the 
Potter's to get Harry. Hagrid would have had to have told Minerva near 
midnight or shortly after that he was going to pick up Harry. It seems 
more likely to me that, having made his arrangements, Dumbledore gave 
the TT to Hagrid and told him when to go get Harry. He would have had to 
know the exact time to send Hagrid back, but that would have been 
provided by Snape. Hagrid would have mentioned to Minerva at breakfast 
perhaps that he was going to pick Harry up and take him to the Dursleys. 
  In this way, Hagrid could have left anytime after DD had his 
arrangements made. Dumbledore's trip to the Ministry may have been to 
acquire a TT. Dumbledore had a much better idea of the time that Hagrid 
would be arriving, just as he knew when to lock the hospital wing door 
when Harry and Hermione returned.

> (xi)  Sirius is laughing when takenby Ministry of Magic personnel 
>(one of the first to arrive beingCornelius Fudge) and soon after placed in 
>Azkaban without trial onBarty Crouch Snr.'s orders (probably because he 
>finally realised that Peter was a good deal smarter than he had believed).

KJ:
   Also, because of the irony of the situation. Sirius felt incredible 
guilt for choosing Peter as the SK and talking James and Lily into 
accepting Peter. I think that he felt that he was responsible for their 
deaths and that Azkaban was a suitable punishment. He was still 
admitting to Harry in PoA that he was the cause of their deaths.