The Needs of Karmic Justice (was re: Cultural standards, etc)

[lupinlore]

No: HPFGUIDX 144702

> Julie:
 After his actions
> on the Tower, and even IF he is DDM, his life is screwed to hell.  
He's
> lost his teaching position, any respect he had from his colleagues
> and the entire WW, he's hated and villified by one side and has to
> dance very carefully to avoid being obliterated by the other side  
(and
> I'm convinced Voldemort still doesn't trust him completely, as he
> doesn't trust *anyone* completely). He's given up everything he 
> earned over the past 16 years. So, Karmic punishment, check.
>  



No, I'm afraid that just doesn't do.  That is to say that the 
scenario you've described simply doesn't fit the needs and 
requirements of karmic punishment as Alla and I and others are 
discussing.  It is true that Snape will have a lot to pay for in 
terms of his actions on the tower, but that frankly isn't what 
interests us (or at least me) in this context.

Karmic punishment means that the punishment in some way is very 
directly and obviously linked with the fault.  Alla has spoken of 
Sirius, and I have, in another thread, spoken of Dumbledore and 
Lockheart.  Let us take things a step further with some speculation.  
Let's suppose that Petunia, as some have hypothesized, is actually a 
witch who has consciously, or perhaps subconsciously, repressed her 
powers in order to live as a muggle.  In book VII, let us further 
suppose, she uses her powers in a moment of high danger, leading 
Vernon to regard her with disgust and say "Never come near me or my 
son again, freak!"  That would be karmic punishment, or if you prefer 
poetic justice.  It would also be very harsh, I agree, but then 
poetic justice almost always IS very harsh -- that is part of its 
poetry.  In any case, it fits the need by being very directly and 
obviously related to Petunia's major fault, the way she has treated 
Harry.

I'm not saying that will happen with Petunia, just that such is a 
speculative example of poetic justice or karmic payback not involving 
Snape.  The example you give (and which many people repeatedly cite) 
certainly does involve Snape, but it does not fit the requirements of 
karmic justice/poetic justice/comeuppance.  As Nora has said, JKR 
certainly likes this type of thing very, very much -- and one reason 
many of us strongly suspected we weren't done with Umbridge was the 
lack of karmic backlash in her case.  And, if JKR is to be, IMO, a 
good writer, not to mention avoiding the enormous mistake of making a 
hero out of a child abuser, then Snape has a great deal of karmic 
payback to work through for his abuse of Harry and Neville.


Lupinlore