Character Discussion: Voldemort - further explanation (long)

[Geoff Bannister]

No: HPFGUIDX 123767


In message 123716, Hans wrote, inter alia, the following:

<quote>
"From comments in the group and privately I see that some people 
think I'm trying to persuade people to accept the Path of Liberation 
as true. That is NOT so. What I AM saying is the JO believes in this 
Path, and my aim is to prove that

.


.
When Geoff says he rejects the Path of Liberation utterly this 
proves he's missed the point. It's not a matter of accepting or 
rejecting the Path. It's a matter of us discovering together what is 
the arch-matrix on which Jo is basing her story. People who really 
want to know that, will consider any theory which shows a remarkable 
number of coincidences, even if they don't believe in the basic 
principles which form the arch-matrix

.



.But I repeat: I am NOT trying to persuade people of the truth of 
the Path, except that it exists, and that Jo and I both believe in 
it

."
</quote>

Geoff:
I have tended to avoid replying to Hans'long series of posts 
outlining character analyses of the main Harry Potter personalities, 
partly because I felt it was difficult in so doing to avoid going 
seriously off-topic.

However, since Hans afforded me the honour of being the only 
individual contributor named, I felt I should rise to the occasion 
and put pen to paper (or should it be keys to VDU?).

Let me start by saying that I have never written that I have rejected 
the path of liberation utterly. That would be an insult to Hans' 
world view. What I have said in the past is that Bible passages 
quoted as part of liberation teaching are taken out of context.

As an example, in message 76745, I wrote:

"Actually, the young man came to Jesus and asked what he needed to do 
to gain eternal life, which I so not consider equates with the four 
sections of your Path of Liberation
.. 


..The crux of Christian teaching can be summed up in John 3:16 and 
not by looking at the four paths which are not founded in the 
teaching of Christ."

This was in response to an interpretation of the rich young ruler's 
question to Jesus.

Hans has made an assumption that Jo Rowling believes in the Path of 
Liberation and has structured his comments about the books on that 
hypothesis. As far as I know, the author has not at any point made 
any such statement of faith.

In an exchange of thoughts in message 121695, we wrote the following:

<quote>
"Hans:
By the way, Geoff Bannister said some time ago that he thought it 
unlikely that Jo would choose such an "obscure" publication as a 
source.
            
In 1616, when this book was published, it was certainly not obscure! 
It was one of a set of three books called "The Rosicrucian 
Manifestos" published during three years. This set raised a real 
furore in Europe in those days. Of course the common people couldn't 
read, let alone afford books, but many of the elite in Europe got 
hold of it and there was a hell of a controversy. In fact this is 
perhaps the most fundamental of all Rosicrucian publications, and 
literally hundreds of other books appeared as a result of it. It was 
definitely the Harry Potter for Grownups in 1616!

Geoff:
I was speaking in modern terms. I wonder how many people here, prior 
to your expositions, knew of the Rosicrucians? (I did - I have a 
friend who is one.)

And, how many folk today throughout the world would count themselves 
as Rosicrucians? Perhaps you can provide an answer."
</quote>

At the moment, I have received no answer to that. As I said, I have a 
friend, a one-time next-door neighbour who is a Rosicrucian which was 
why I knew of the order but I am given to conclude that the number of 
followers is small and it seems to be little known which is why I 
wondered how Jo Rowling, assuming that she /does/ know of it, came 
into contact.

With the two other commonly quoted writers on this group, namely CS 
Lewis and JRR Tolkien, Contributors have pointed out that you can 
pick up on their Christian faith from their writings. Lewis made no 
secret of the fact that the Narnia books were overt allegories of the 
Christian faith; "The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe" has Aslan the 
Lion, the Son of the Great Emperor-over-Sea as a Christ figure who is 
killed in the place of a traitor and comes back to life.

Tolkien, a devout Catholic, did not express his beliefs so overtly 
but there are nods in the direction of Christian belief in the book 
and, if you read the opening sections of "the Silmarillion" –
"Ainulindalë" and "Valaquenta" you will find a cosmology of angelic 
beings, one of whom is fallen, not dissimilar to that accepted, 
particularly in Catholic circles.

JKR has intimated in the past that she is a Christian and worships 
with the Church of Scotland – which as an aside provoked a thread on 
Calvinism quite recently – and I believe that, like Tolkien, her 
belief shows covertly in the way in which her stories progress. I see 
no evidence of the Path of Liberation ideas which could easily be 
picked up and realised by an average reader and if that is the case, 
why weave this world view into a book where it will not be recognised?

With respect, I have not missed the point about Liberation teaching; 
I do not see it being present as the matrix of the story. I do agree 
that, personally, I do not accept the idea of the Path of Liberation.

In message 76588, Hans, writing as Ivan Vablatsky said:

"In previous messages I have expounded my theory that HP is the 
timeless story of human liberation."             

and again, he made the observation in post 111592:

"Hans:
OK that's my theory. Tell me I'm insane; I can take it. But let me 
tell you this: the same story is told in the Bible, the Alchemical 
Wedding of Christian Rosycross, and many other books."

Now, we are being told that Jo has embraced the Liberation ideal and 
is writing Harry Potter as an allegorical representation of this. And 
yet, theory?

Many people on this group subscribe to different world views. I 
accept this, but I  also know that I subscribe to the Christian view 
because it is so simple and yet so profound and I have experienced it 
not as a theory but practically in my life.

In reply to Hans' message 111592 (quoted above), I wrote:

"With respect, the basis of Christian belief is much less complicated 
than that and can be summed up in two quotes from Jesus:

God so loved the world that He gave his only Son so that whoever 
believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father 
except through me.

Very simple to understand but very difficult to accept and commit to."

This is Christian belief stripped of theory, ritual or even religion, 
It is faith. And I believe it has permeated the writings of the three 
authors I have discussed because it represents their core belief and 
thus - overtly or covertly – their view of the created world.

My apologies for a post which was intended to be short but, like 
Topsy, has growed.