Favorite Snape Scenes - He's such a lovely professor, no really.

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 122789


> > > Renee:
>  What if DD,  knowing  Snape was a Death Eater, hadn't 
listened when Snape  showed up but  immediately handed him 
over to the  authorities?<
> > 
> > Pippin:
> > I didn't notice Dumbledore reading Fake!Moody his rights 
before  stunning him and dosing him with veritaserum. Snape 
isn't  nearly as powerful as Dumbledore, he doesn't have 
backup, he  doesn't have a bottle of veritaserum handy and he's 
 outnumbered in a  hostage situation. 
> 
> Renee:
> Now the issue is getting muddled, I think. What triggered this 
 exchange was Alla's remark that Snape didn't treat Lupin the 
way DD  treated him, which I then compared to the parable of the 
ungrateful  servant. DD's later treatment of Fake!Moody doesn't 
change that (and  it's debatable whether the situations are 
comparable, but that's  irrelevant here). DD listened to Snape. 
Snape bound and gagged  Lupin, insulted him and threatened to 
drag him from the Shrieking  Shack.    <

Pippin:
But that's my point. You said that Dumbledore had listened to 
Snape, and so Snape should have listened to Lupin. I say that 
the situation Snape found himself in was more comparable to 
Dumbledore's discovery of Fake!Moody than it was to Snape's 
defection. We don't know the circumstances of that, but we do 
know that Snape "came back to our side" --it was voluntary.  

That is a very different situation than confronting a  Death Eater 
who has a student in his power.  

> > Pippin:
> > Um, how could Snape listen to Lupin if Lupin was gagged? If 
Snape ungags Lupin, he's in danger of being spellbound 
himself. Sirius has just admitted to knowing an illegal 
wandless  spell, and has already taken three armed students 
hostage with  it. 
> 
> Renee: 
> Apparently the snippage has created some confusing here: I 
wasn't  suggesting that Snape listen to Lupin. I was comparing 
Lupin and  Sirius who listened to Harry when he told them not to 
kill  Pettigrew, to Snape who did *not* listen to Harry's arguments 
in  favour of Sirius and Lupin. <

Pippin:
Okay. But you say that Snape changed his mind later. Fine, but 
how do we know that he didn't take Harry's opinion into account 
then? We know that  he has to pretend not to take Harry 
seriously.  That much of OscarWinner!Snape is canon.

Renee: 
> And if Sirius could have used his illegal wandless spell 
against  Snape, then why does he blanch and start pleading 
when Snape  threatens to call the Dementors, instead using it? 
<

Pippin:
::sigh::Snape thinks he is dealing with Death Eaters. He is not, 
under any circumstances, going to negotiate with them, whether 
they threaten or plead or promise to go quietly.  If Sirius wants to 
go to the castle, then Snape is bound to think that it's a trick.

> Pippin: 
> > We have no canon that Snape knows how to lift a confundus 
> > charm.
> 
> Renee:
> Well, if he can't, why does he apply for the job of DADA 
teacher?

Pippin:
 Harry is still supposed to be confunded when he wakes up at 
the castle, and I don't see Fudge asking whether there is any 
way to lift the spell, as he does when he's stymied by Marietta's 
spots. I conclude he knows there isn't any easy way to lift it.

> Pippin: 
> > This is something I  don't really understand about the "Snape 
isn't really on the side  of good, he's out for himself" theories.  
Just what is Snape  supposed to be out for? He's a clever wizard 
who knows a potion  that feigns death -- he wouldn't have to join 
DD just to get shut of  Voldie. If Snape doesn't care whether the 
good guys win, what is  he after?
> > 
> Renee:
> Personal glory, perhaps? 

Pippin:
The motives of personal glory and revenge (suggested by Alla ) 
don't fit very well. If Snape wanted personal glory, why become a 
spy and work in the shadows? If he wanted revenge, why did he 
defect to Dumbledore and not Crouch, who would have let him 
fight fire with fire?

Renee:
> But I don't know if Snape is or isn't really on the side of good. 
To  my best knowledge, I didn't doubt his loyalties in this 
exchange,  just his behaviour. And most of the time, I prefer him 
to end up  redeemed, either dead or alive.

Pippin:
I guess this is where we use the word 'redeemed' differently. To 
me, a character who erred but is now is on the side of good has 
already been redeemed, though that character may still have 
many flaws and make mistakes.

Pippin