More Snape Defense, regarding Snape's childhood. (Long)

[nrenka]

No: HPFGUIDX 122832


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, Magda Grantwich 
<mgrantwich at y...> wrote:

> And how many times has someone said oh it's not Sirius' fault that
> he's insensitive or reckless, the poor guy never had a chance to
> mature in Azkaban because he went there when he was 21/22 boo hoo 
> hoo poor baby?  THere are personality traits and mental processes 
> that are hardwired by the time you're in your teens and there's not 
> a lot that can be done to change them.

Make a Snapethread, and a Black comparison is bound to come around 
eventually.  They really MUST be twins, or something.  (Structurally 
they are in many ways, but that's another thread.)

My main problem with such is that the two situations do not have the 
same level of textual reality--at the present.  The general suckage 
of an Azkaban stay is objectively established as textual fact 
(reinforced by two characters' experience and description thereof), 
and commented on by JKR in external interview source.

As Alla pointed out, the Young!Snape memories are very possibly 
memories of a crappy childhood--but they aren't necessarily.  We have 
a set of images that could easily be fit into several different 
interpretations.  I happen to suspect that they ARE pretty face-
value, but I can't say that with confidence at present.  It's 
partially similar with the Hogwarts years--we have one incident that 
is genuinely painful to read, but we cannot textually confirm as of 
yet that our reading of that incident should extend to cover the 
entire period.  Part of it is 'real', part of it is conjecture.

We have a moderate problem of incommensurability again here: can we 
compare an Azkaban stay with a potentially abusive home situation and 
schooldays bullying?  I don't know.

> There are several instances throughout the books that Snape has only
> the most rudimentary concept of normal human relationships.  His
> belief in POA that Lupin is still friends with Sirius Black despite
> Sirius' apparent betrayal of the Order and the Potters shows us that
> he doesn't have a clue what real friendship is about.  His
> all-or-nothing commitment to a cause doesn't indicate much exposure
> to tolerant viewpoints.  His way of dealing with classes through
> intimidation of his forceful personality, his undoubted knowledge of
> his subject and his image of darkness shows that he is taking the
> easy way out when it comes to dealing with students.

What is so interesting, then, is *why*.  Why the conversion back to 
the white hats, and perhaps why the maintenance of such behavior.  
[For me, the why of conversion is The Big Question that will probably 
make things fall into place, both analytically and critically.]

To state my own question, I wonder why or if being around someone 
like Dumbledore, in close contact with him for so long and most 
likely wanting his approval, taking him as a guiding force...why that 
hasn't had more positive effects than it has.  It's a guess on my 
part that is has been positive, I admit; and this is probably to be 
filed in the 'hopeless optimist' category.  I can't escape the idea 
of Dumbledore as a positive influence upon a character...and then we 
get into the question of "can't, or won't?", which is also 
unanswerable at the time being.  Evidence can point either way.

-Nora notes that this (for her) is another subject to be filed 
under 'inadequate canon: open book in summer 2005, please'