Imperius and Occlumency - Another Perspective

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 122842


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, juli17 at a... wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Tonks wrote:
> > 
> > Yes. LV would use Snape to kill Harry. Look at what Snape did when 
> > he saw Harry looking in the pensive. Snape lost his cool. LV would 
> > have looked through Harry into Snape, triggered Snape's rage and 
> > Harry would have been in very serious danger. Snape knew this. 
> > Snape knew his weakness and how the Dark Lord could use it. So he 
> > put this weak part into the pensive to protect Harry during the 
> > session. 


> Julie says:
> ... it could explain one thing that bothered me about Snape's 
> reaction. WHY was he so angry that Harry saw this scene of the 
> Marauders bullying him? Yes, Snape didn't come off too well, but 
> James and Sirius come off much worse. ... You'd think Snape would 
> feel immense satisfaction at Harry having to face the "truth" about 
> James, .... Instead Snape is furious. But is he furious that Harry 
> witnessed his humiliation, or furious that Harry's action may have 
> put both their lives further at risk?
> 
> 
> Julie 

bboyminn:

In concept I agree with Tonks, but not in detail. I do believe that
Snape knows things that could potentially be of danger to Harry
relative to Voldemort. But I don't think the key is Snape's anger or
emotions.

Snape knows secrets, it's as simple as that. Snape knows things about
Voldemort, Dumbledore, the Death Eaters, and the Order that are
secret; logically, reasonably, and justfiably secret. Harry simply can
not be allowed to know them. Illustration; what if Voldemort captures
Harry and probes Harry's mind, what if Voldemort sees things there
that Harry can't possibly know? That spells trouble in my book. So,
there are some things that Snape knows that for practical reason must
remain the secrets that they are. 

Now on a personal level, there are things in Snape's life, just as in
each of our own lives, that he doesn't want people to know about, and
very specific things he doesn't want Harry to know about.

Both of those seem like perfectly justifiable reason for Snape to hide
memories in the Pensieve.

However, I'm sure Harry has his own /personal/ secrets. Things he
feels he has every justifiable reason to hide. Unfortunately, he is
not afforded the luxury of storing them in a Pensieve where they can
safely remain his personal secrets. 

Imagine being forced into that situation like Harry was. Imagine the
person you loath most, being allowed to probe your most intimate
thoughts, desires, and memories. That would be extremely unpleasant
and upsetting for anyone.

As far as Occlumency making Harry's situation worse, well, it is a
very *physically*, mentally, and emotionally stressful thing, and
stress and aggitation are the very things that Harry needs to avoid.
So, I'm not so sure that it is Occlumency itself, but rather the
stress and strain of trying to learn it that are causing the problem. 

In addition, the stress and strain, mostly due to Umbridge, in Harry's
daily life is also increasing. There are plenty of on-going, even
accelerating, reasons for Harry's stress level to be increasing, and
therefore his ability to cope with the stresss proportionally
decreasing. Further, that stress, as it always does, is producing
shallow and fitful sleep, which makes him more vulnerable to his
connection to Voldemort.

Regarding, Snape's teaching methods, I think Snape had no great desire
to take on the task but realize that, at the same time, he was the
most logical person to do it. That said, I don't think he did it with
any enthusiasm. We've all had teachers like that. The coach who is
assign to teach Biology, which he has no qualifications for, so he
just goes through the motions and does the basic amount required. I
think that's what Snape did, he truly did the job, but no more what
was necessary to be able to say he did the job. 

Example, Snape says Harry can use any means or method to defend
himself, but gives Harry no suggestions as to effective means or
methods of doing so. Harry was just left to work it out on his own in
the heat of the moment. 

Snape tells Harry to clear his mind especially before bedtime, but
again gives him no means nor methods for doing so; no deep breathing
excersizes, no creative visualization, no meditation techniques, no
relaxation techniques, no warm cup of herbal tea, no pleasant
distracting book to read before bed, despite the fact that these
various methods are centuries old techniques.

In addition, as a reader, after seeing how the Legilimency Charm works
and seeing examples of Harry actively resisting it, I'm sure I could
formulate an instructive explanation of how to resist the effect. In
saying that, I realize the resistance is a very internal thing, and
acknowledge I could only give illustrative instruction rather that
literal, but I feel they would still be helpful and effective. 

In addition, I would take a progressive approach. Start by giving
Harry time to marshal resistance until he showed some ability, then
gradually create more difficult and demanding tests. You have to learn
to walk before you can run. That's all pretty standard teaching technique.

All that said, of course, Snape would never do any of that because JKR
needed the story to go in the direction it did. She need Harry to do
poorly at it, she needed Snape to be nasty, and she ultimately needed
Harry to look into the Pensieve and see what he saw.

Regarding Snape's reaction, certainly and logically, his first and
foremost reaction would be regarding himself and his humiliation. No
one ever wants to be humiliated, and certainly don't want other people
to find out about it.

Only later, absent the immediate emotions, would he be calm enough to
see the potential for Harry to gain a new perspective on James and
Sirius. That could very well appear in the next book. 

Bad as it was, I do feel, after some tense negotiation between them,
the effects of the Occlumency leason will lead to a gradual easing of
the hostility between Snape and Harry.

Just a few thoughts.

Steve/bboyminn