Paradox of Time Travel in PoA

[delwynmarch]

No: HPFGUIDX 132031


davenclaw wrote:
"I think the reason that I disagree with what you are saying can be
summarized with one question: How did Harry ever get the opportunity
to use the time-turner to summon the Patronus to drive away the
dementors?  They were about to kill him.  How did he survive in order
to be able to save himself?"

Del replies:
He survived because TT!Harry saved him.

davenclaw wrote:
"There were a series of events which were altered when he went back in
time.  We never see them, and no one knows about them.  "

Del replies:
No no no :-) What was there but we didn't know about was TT!Harry and
Hermione.

davenclaw wrote:
"I think you are confusing the fact that there is no memory of the 
original events with the idea that there never was a different set of
events.  That just cannot be the case.  Harry couldn't save himself
until he was given the opportunity to do so.  "

Del replies:
You are making the past depend on the future, which is not logical.
You are basically saying "Harry cannot be saved now because he must
first decide to Time-Turn in the future". But that's not the way
Time-Turning works.

Harry is saved in the present because a second set of Harry and
Hermione appeared out of nowhere in his PAST. The present depends on
the past, now that makes sense.

The question of WHY that second set appeared out of thin air is
irrelevant to the present. All that matters is that it did, and that
it can now influence the present.

davenclaw wrote:
"People have been saying that there is one time with two Harrys.  But
 until the moment in time occurred when they used the time-turner,
there WAS NO TIME-TRAVELING HARRY in existence."

Del replies:
YES THERE WAS :-) There was ALWAYS a Time-Turning Harry because Harry
Time-Turned. 

The timeline was ALWAYS: a second set of Harry and Hermione appear out
of thin air at 6, they save the "original" Harry sometime later, and
that original Harry decides to Time-Turn at 9. It IS that way.

The fact that Harry and Hermione TT at some point means that they
appear at some point in the past. If they don't TT, they don't appear,
but if they don't appear, they don't TT either. This means that there
CANNOT be a timeline where the second set of Harry and Hermione isn't
present in the past and yet Harry and Hermione decide to TT. The two
events go together: they TT, they exist in the past. It's both or
none. And obviously in PoA it's both :-)

Del