Dumbledore, Aslan, Gandalf, and Obi

[Trish]

No: HPFGUIDX 135554

Magica wrote:
> I think there are many similarities between the death of DD and 
> Aslan, the great lion of Narnia, who is killed by the evil witch 
on 
> the stone table in "The lion, The witch and The wardrobe". The 
lion 
> also pleads with the witch to kill him, so that he can return 
> stronger and more magical than ever. Same thing with the death of 
> Gandalf in LOTR. 

I couldn't agree more. In fact, as a member of Narnia and LOTR 
boards, HP comes up a lot there as well. Mostly with folks saying 
that JKR stole storyline but there I do not agree. I think it is 
just sour grapes on the popularity of HP. Personally, I think that 
JKR does follow a model for these stories as you all know. So, 
looking at the model of the top 3 SciFi/Fantasy series w/o HP:

Mentor:Hero:Mentor Chooses to Die IN FRONT OF HERO to make hero 
stronger: Mentor comes 'back from dead' in some way::

Chronicals of Narnia:LWW
Aslan:Susan/Lucy:Killed at stone table in front of S/L:Returned from 
dead to win the fight against the white witch . Some would say more 
powerful and since there are all those Christian paralels I would 
say probably. 

LOTR
Gandalf:Fellowship(Frodo): Killed fighting the meany balrog in front 
of fellowship (or at least sucked away right?): Returned to win the 
fight against sauron but in White form, much more stronger magic.

Star Wars
ObiWon Kenobi:Luke: Killed by Darth Vadar in front of Luke (some say 
he waited for Luke) : Returned as a voice of the force to help Luke 
at all times so he could defeat the Dark Side.
--this one is my husbands, but it sure fits too!

So now we have three ways to approach HP

Dumbledore:Harry Potter: Killed by Snape with HP in a frozen state 
as to witness the event: Returns or not in some way

What are the choices:
1) Rises from dead : I don't believe JKR would do this, too 
associated with dark magic now.
2) Nothing, DD is gone, a distant memory and anyway, he didn't 
choose to die he JUST was ak'd
3) DD more powerfully speaks to Harry in certain ways: Through 
portrait, through letters, through his need to avenge his death 
along with his parents...I don't know.

I think the only conclusion is that DD wanted to die. I can't look 
at it any other way and have it 'work' for our hero. This is another 
reason why I don't think Harry has to die to be the hero. Yes in 
classical hero stories the hero dies, but JKR does not seem to be 
following that model. Plus I think she always thinks of her child 
audience and, while she never underestimates what they can handle, 
also understands depression and what sacrifice means to the young.
Anyway, thats a different subject isn't it?


Magica also said
> How do these magical portraits work, has anyone discussed this 
> before? Must they be painted by a special artist while the person 
is 
> still alive, maybe leaving some of his or hers sole in the 
portrait 
> through a mini-horcrux?

Me again:
I don't think it is a mini-horcrux persay because Horcruxes don't 
seem to be 'okay' magic. They are not even spoken of. But there is 
something to the portraits. I don't think they are exactly 'painted' 
either, Dumbledores appeared in his office rather quickly. But they 
do have thoughts, feelings etc. and CAN deliver messages unlike a 
photograph. Also, not everyone has a painting. I know this was 
talked about years ago on this board but I don't know what JKR has 
said on it. Anyone??

Trish. (A lurker who has read every post **whew**)