Foreshadowing? Two Places to Hide Horcruxes

[hermionegallo]

No: HPFGUIDX 135804

I knew you'd bite, Jen!

> Jen: Hi hg! Glad to see you posting. About the cup, the one I was 
> referring to was the sevices to the school award, not the 
Hufflepuff 
> cup, is that what you're saying, too? I re-read your link and think 
> we're referring to the same thing. (Although I do have some 
> reservations the award is a Horcrux, see below).

hg:
Oh, yes, we werer referring to the same thing, then.  But the special 
services award is a plaque.

 
> Jen: If Tom truly did make his Horcruxes 
> after 'significant' deaths, I'm wondering whether he would consider 
> his grandparents significant? They always seemed like an 
> afterthought. I doubt he would have considered them important 
enough 
> to come back later and murder, if they'd happened to be out the 
> night Riddle Sr. got AK'd... 
But I'm still wondering about the diary. I do think Myrtle's death, 
> although indirect and unplanned, would have been significant to 
> Riddle. She's killed by the basilisk he's controlling with 
> Parseltoungue, so I do think it was a murder, even if unintended. 
> 
> So that would mean he created the diary and the ring while at 
> Hogwarts, but not the award. 

hg:
I would think he'd consider the murder of the three Riddles 
significant in that he completely eradicated the Riddle family.  As 
tempting as it is to consider Myrtle's death one that he can use to 
make a horcrux, I'm having difficulty embracing it.  On the one hand, 
it was deliberate that he opened the chamber, deliberate that he 
wanted to kill people, even, with the basilisk.  Well, he did 
instruct it to kill her, didn't he?  Okay, now I'm torn.

What I liked so much about the award was the theft of honor attached 
to it, the same as he stole back his lineage with the ring and his 
mother's honor with the locket, and he stole something belonging to 
Hogwarts (cup) from a greedy, vain slob.  Stealing something that he 
would feel he has a right to or deserves.  I really like what you 
said here:

Jen:
 If that's true, it follows 
> that Riddle's request for a job at Hogwarts was a ruse to steal 
> either the sword or a Ravenclaw artifact.

hg:
I think a major part of the puzzle will be determining why he wants 
to get back into Hogwarts.  I've always been a bit shaky on him 
wanting to get back in to take something back: as if he's got a 
magpie nest somewhere and wants to collect his things?  No, 
Dumbledore found his nest and made him give them back when they were 
in a nest, so he'd never do that again.
> 
> hg:
> > Furthermore, Voldemort murdered Hepzibah Smith a long time after
> > he graduated; in order for Harry to find a cup Horcrux at
> > Hogwarts, Riddle would have had to make the cup Horcrux and the
> > locket Horcrux at the time of Smith's murder (having saved out a 
> > Riddle murder) and slipped the cup Horcrux into the school the
> > night of his interview with Dumbledore.  It seems a stretch.
> 
> Jen: Actually, the Borgin & Burkes job was right after Hogwarts, 
> after he was rejected for the teaching position. I'm guessing he 
> worked there from ages 18 or 19 until his early 20's, when the 
> Hepzibah murder took place. 

hg: 
Smith's murder was a long enough time out of Hogwarts that he 
wouldn't be trying to put a cup horcrux back in there, is what I 
meant.  I got the impression that he worked for B&B for about 5 
years, which would have him disappearing for about 20 years.  That 
part of the timeline has me confused, because Dumbledore says that 
Riddle hasn't been seen for about 10 years when he shows up at the 
headmaster's office, and Dumbledore doesn't become headmaster until 
1970.  Seems like there's a missing 10 years somewhere.

Jen:
 
> It's more likely he used the Hufflepuff cup for the Hepzibah 
Horcrux 
> than the locket. She was distantly descended from Helga Hufflepuff 
> and he probably saw her as a rather silly woman, unworthy of the 
> prized Slytherin locket once worn by his mother. Now THAT Horcrux 
> would be made after a very, very significant murder that we haven't 
> heard of yet or havne't pinned down. But as to where he hid the 
> Hufflepuff cup, I have no idea at the moment.

hg:
Excellent, valid point.
Maybe he thought: "Ring, Diary, Locket: grandparents (I disassociate 
myself with your heritage); Diary (I have the power to kill people 
right here at my own school and still be a beloved student); Locket 
(that's for you, Tom senior, for running out on my mother)."  Then 
Smith's murder would be for the cup, and maybe there was a Griffindor 
murder and a Ravenclaw murder for two other items?...  ehhh...

So I thought I had at least part of this puzzle worked out -- I was 
onto other theories, now.  Back to the drawing board a bit on Tom.  
hg.