PoA - Snape knew?

[ginny343]

No: HPFGUIDX 143404

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "colebiancardi" <muellem at b...> 
wrote:
>
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "ginny343" <ginny343 at y...> 
> wrote:
> >
> > I had a thought this morning and although I have not thought it 
> > completely through, I decided to post it.
> > 
> > We know from PoA that the DEs knew that Peter was a spy.  
> > 
> > "You've been hiding from Voldemort's old supporters . . . Sounds 
> like 
> > they think the double-crosser double-crossed them . . . " (Am. 
ver. 
> p. 
> > 368)
> > 
> > So, he was probably part of the /circle/ (literally) of 
supporters 
> > that Voldemort would call to him (like in the graveyard).  There 
> was a 
> > place for Snape too (the one he thought had left him forever).  
So 
> > that means, like all the other DEs (loyal or not), Snape knew 
Peter 
> > was the spy.
> 
> c: I don't believe anyone knew about Peter back in 1980/1981 as 
being 
> a spy for Voldemort - it doesn't seem that way in the books.  
Also, 
> since Voldy kind of mistrusts his DE's, he probably kept them in 
the 
> dark about their roles.  In GoF, when Snape is accused of being a 
DE, 
> he wasn't labeled as a spy, just a DE.
> 
> But because of the Order of the Phoenix, I would think that 
Peter's 
> role would be kept hush-hush.  His name never, as far as we have 
been 
> privy to, came up in an court/trial scenes as being a Death Eater.

Ginny:
Back in 1980/81 I'm not sure people didn't know about Peter.  
According to PoA, the Order thought "someone" close to the Potters 
were passing information and Sirius accused Peter of having been 
passing information to LV for a year before James and Lily's death.  
Sirius also said that Peter was hiding from the LV's supporters who 
weren't in Azkaban because they thought Peter had caused LV's 
downfall when he had gone to the Potter's Peter's info.  So, at 
least some of the DEs knew Peter gave the information and Peter knew 
it (hence his hiding as a rat).

About the court/trial, I might be wrong here, but I thought the 
scenes we've witnessed were after LV's downfall.  I find it hard to 
believe Karkaroff would betray fellow DE's if LV was still in 
power.  So, everyone assumed Peter to be dead.  It would be 
pointless to accuse him.
 
> 
> > 
> > That given, I am a little confused about why Sirius was believed 
to 
> be 
> > a spy.  Did they think there was two spies working on the same 
> thing?  
> 
> c:I don't think they thought there were two spies - I think that 
> since Sirius was supposed to be the Secret Keeper and everyone 
knew 
> it and then James & Lily are found by Voldemort, people believed 
that 
> Sirius betrayed them(not necessarily a spy, mind you) and since 
James 
> and Lily were dead and Peter assumed dead, who was going to 
believe 
> Sirius?
> 
Ginny:
Okay, but here is my main question.  If the DEs knew that Peter gave 
the information on LV, then it is really hard to believe that Snape 
didn't know that.  So if Snape is really concerned that Sirius is 
dangerous to Harry, he must have thought both Peter and Sirius were 
on LVs side.  

> > Did Snape think Sirius went after Peter to kill him because 
Peter 
> had 
> > caused the downfall of Voldemort? 
> 
> 
> c: Snape didn't know about Peter in the Shack.  He followed Lupin 
> because a) Lupin forgot his drink that evening and b) was 
curious.  
> He didn't know the children were in the Shack, or Sirius when he 
> started out.

Ginny:
Okay, I posted this badly and got really confused at the response.  
I meant, right after J&L were killed (in 1981), did Snape think 
Sirius went after Peter to kill him because he caused the downfall 
of LV or did Snape think Peter (grieving) went after Sirius because 
his friends were dead.  I don't think Snape could have believed 
Peter went after Sirius out of grief (as everyone had thought) 
because he must have known Peter was the one to betray.  I know that 
is confusing.  Even if Snape didn't know at the time that Peter was 
the one passing information, as the years went on, with some DEs 
knowing it was Peter passing information . . . he must have realized 
it.  I mean, he is friends with the Malfoys and teaches many of the 
DE's kids.
> 
>  > 7th book, I am a little disappointed to think that Snape knew 
> about 
> > Peter, and yet the teachers in the school believed Peter to be 
> > innocent.
> 
> 
> c:I don't think Snape knew Peter's role with Voldemort until AFTER 
> PoA & BEFORE GoF.  Hence, I don't think there is anything to be 
> disappointed about :-)
> 
Ginny:
I hope you are right, but I need more convincing. 

> > of what happened in PoA, Snape should have told the minister 
that 
> > Black was not the one who got James and Lily killed.  Why didn't 
he?
> 
> c:At that point and time, Snape still believed Sirius was the 
Secret 
> Keeper who betrayed James & Lily - no one told him otherwise (or 
at 
> least, someone with creditability)   Dumbledore most likely filled 
> Snape in after the scene in the Hospital Ward.
> 
Ginny:
Did Snape really still think Sirius was the Secret Keeper?  Even 
though LV's supporters knew Peter gave the information?


Ginny343, still feeling that at the beginning of PoA Snape knew more 
than he was sharing.  And maybe because he hated Sirius . . . but 
wouldn't that cause his problems with DD?