Dumbledore's pleading

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 141498

Carol:
> I agree completely that Snape knew each other very well, and I like
> your idea of a poignant last moment on the tower, but I don't think
> that Snape's change of expression (to hatred and revulsion) can be
> explained without the Legilimency, whatever the images DD sent. If
> it were a last goodbye, he surely would not have worn that
> expression. If it's a sacrifice, then I think Dumbledore is
> telling him that he must play his part because Dumbledore can't do
> it alone. (Plus information on legilimency in post #141428)

zgrinius:
> I find this plausible myself, but clearly many do not. (For 
> example, I feel both men are sufficiently logical and analytical to
> independently reach the same conclusion, that Snape's killing of DD
> is the "least evil" under the circumstances, as is being debated in
> the "Cold Equations" thread. They might reasonably also know each
> other well enough to be *sure* the other is on the same page). On
> the other hand, assuming Legilimency is limited to simple images
> (no conversation) the mutual understanding that exists between DD
> and Snape could help Snape to correctly interpret such a crude
> exchange.

Jen: Both of you are very convincing on the legilimency angle! And I 
don't dispute the canon you presented, as zgrinius said, if JKR 
reveals legilimency between them it wouldn't be cheating.

Here's the exact sentence again: "Snape gazed for a moment at 
Dumbledore, and there was revulsion and hatred etched in the harsh 
lines of his face. 'Severus...please.."

Given the construction of the above sentence, I read the revulsion 
and hatred to be on his face *during* the seconds he gazed at 
Dumbledore, not that his face changed after gazing at Dumbledore.  

My thought about legilimency is, what could Dumbledore say Snape 
wouldn't know? Snape knew his options the moment he surveyed the 
scene. His expertise in healing dark magic effects told him 
Dumbledore was suffering from something lethal again, like with the 
ring, plus he knew the Order was patrolling that night and did so 
whenever Dumbledore went away (thus why he was in his room). Snape 
likely knew or guessed Harry went with Dumbledore that night and saw 
the two brooms. A wandless Dumbledore signaled DD had chosen not to 
defend himself, plus the DE told Snape Draco couldn't kill 
Dumbledore.

Even though Dumbledore was willing to die if needed that night, I 
don't believe he asked Snape to do the deed. Instead, the revulsion 
and hatred were all Snape's at the moment his hand was forced, when 
the spinner truly met his end. Taking the UV was one thing, but 
actually facing the result of his actions was 
another. 'Severus...please...' Dumbledore tried to avoid this 
moment, prolong it, but there was absolutely nothing he could do 
once Snape appeared on the tower and the Vow was in play. The orders 
are over at that point, the general and his lieutenant have faded 
away to two men. Snape must be the one to act, to make the choice. I 
do think Dumbledore's words hold meaning for Snape and refer to 
something between them which they both understand, but as to what....

One last thought on legilimency, another reason this might be 
difficult for the plot is how it would come back to Harry. It's hard 
to imagine Snape telling Harry "then he used legilimency to tell me 
what I should do in that moment" or something similar.

Valky:
> Besides, I think it's given that Dumbledore didn't mistakenly walk 
> into the trap but knowingly and preparedly, by his saying to 
> Draco "Yes, and No."

Jen: Yes! Good thought there. One cryptic comment solved :). 

Valky:
> He also says that he has known Draco was trying to kill him all
> year, but he didn't approach Draco for he knew it would be instant
> death for Draco and his family, and further he tells Harry
> straight to the point, that *all* of this, Draco's mission, Snapes
> UV, it's all *unimportant* on the scale of things. He's dealt with
> it.

Jen: Dumbledore stated he could freely talk to Draco finally, 
without fear of Voldemort using legilimency against him. Why are 
they free now? My guess is because Dumbledore knew his own death 
would make legilimency against Draco unnecessary (and by the point 
he gave up his wand he knows his death that night is inevitable).

Valky:
> I really love how Jen writes that destiny had brought Snape and
> Harry to the Tower that night although Dumbledore may not have
> willed it so. <g> I do like the thought that JKR brought this such
> element into the story on the tower.

Jen: After I wrote that, I realized JKR is the god-like hand of fate 
in that one-lol!

Alla:
> It would have been SO much easier to die if he stayed in
> Hogsmeade, IMO, NO? Especially if you are arguing that DD did not
> want either Snape or Harry to be there.

> Just send Harry away, especially since DD specifically made Harry
> promise to leave him if he says so, and Dumbledore can die in
> peace. Why go to Tower in the first place, if Dumbledore is
> planning to sacrifice himself?

Jen: Everything meaningful for Dumbledore is at Hogwarts and he 
knows the DE's came for him. If the DE's were unable to find 
Dumbledore, and the Order couldn't hold them off, there's no telling 
what kind of destruction might take place. (Also, Rosmerta under the 
Imperius might tip Draco off with the coins).

To clarify my point about the tower, I believe Dumbledore was 
willing to die when he went to the tower, and expected it would be 
difficult to defend himself alone against a group of DE's in his 
weakned state. Maybe he wasn't acting as a sacrificial lamb so much 
as trying to divert Draco and the DE's to him & safeguard Harry (and 
Hogwarts) by sending him away. But the odds were against Dumbledore 
surviving an attack alone, and we know it wouldn't worry or scare 
him to die if it came to that. 

Sending Harry to bring Snape back to the tower served the dual 
purpose of safeguarding Harry and proving his trust that Severus 
would do the right thing in forcing the DE's to leave Hogwarts and 
not touch Harry once DD was dead.

Jen, thanking everyone for their kind words :).