Snape and DD's ideology (Was: Motivations for Joining DEs )

[ellecain]

No: HPFGUIDX 140955

Nora wrote:
> <snip>
> Speaking of that, my counterquestion is still open.  We've got 
hints 
> and such that Snape is something of an ideological kindred to 
> Voldemort--can anyone provide me with arguments for Snape as an 
> *ideological* counterpart to Dumbledore?  Canon for Snape 
believing 
> in the power of love, believing the best of people, faith, hope, 
> charity, teamwork, friendship?


Carol responds:
I can give you one example of teamwork. Snape initiates the effort by
all the teachers (or at least the heads of houses) to inform Lockhart
that his opportunity to demonstrate his DADA expertise has arisen:
When Lockhart enters the room, *all* of the teachers look at 
him "with
something remarkably like hatred," but it's Snape who initiates the
action with "Just the man. The very man.  A girl has been snatched by
the monster, Lockhart. Taken into the Chamber of Secrets itself. Your
moment has come at last." In short, Lockhart can either save Ginny
Weasley or pack his suitcases. This sentiment is echoed first by
Sprout, then by the usually gentle Flitwick, then by Snape again, and
then by McGonagall, who puts the stamp of finality on Snape's
suggestion by stating that "tonight will be a fine time to do it" 
(CoS
293-94). The heads of houses have acted as a team following Snape's
lead. It's clear that they all hate Lockhart, but they feel no such
antipathy to Snape.


Elyse: I don't know how convincing this is as an example of teamwork 
but, at the end of GoF, he accepts an
uncomfortable truce with Sirius Black, the person who nearly got him 
killed
years before: "Very slowly - but still glaring at each other ....  
Sirius and Snape moved toward each other
and shook hands. They let go extremely quickly." Or something like 
that.Dont have GoF with me.

I think this would be a splendid example of teamwork really.
I mean the kind of bitter enmity Snape and Sirius share, is put 
aside as they prepare for the Wizarding World War 2. 
That you can work with someone who bullied you years before, pulled 
a psychotic prank that nearly got you killed, and someone who you 
believed for 13 years, betrayed his best friends to be murdered 
while you did all you could to save them at the time, well I'd say 
that's a sort of teamwork, even if they didn't actually do anything 
together.

Carol:
And his decision to help and protect Draco at Narcissa's request,
whether or not he knew the nature of Draco's task (he did not
anticipate the third provision), can be interpreted as true 
friendship
or even charity in the sense of agape love, especially when the price
of failure is his own death.

Elyse: Once again I don't know how convincing this is, but as Lupin 
says, Snape did concoct the Wolfsbane potion perfectly, despite the 
fact that he hated and suspected Lupin of helping a mass murderer 
into the castle. Of course you can say this was done out of duty but 
I guess you could construe it as a form of charity? I mean he could 
have refused to make the potion before DD hired Lupin, but he agreed 
and made it "perfectly, so I did not suffer as I usually do at the 
full moon."

Carol 
Faith? Quite possibly he has faith in Dumbledore even after
Dumbledore's death by his hand. That's a topic for another post. 
Hope?
I don't know. Maybe he hopes that Voldemort will fall, that the 
Chosen
One for all his failings (in Snape's eyes) will save the WW. For
himself, his own future, I'm quite sure he holds no hope.

Elyse:  I agree, completely. If he had any hope for himself pre HBP, 
hes definitely lost it now. 
As for the faith question, I would have to say, that the most 
glaring example we have of Canon Snape is the time that he came to 
Dumbledore.
It was a year before LV was destroyed, and at that time LV was at 
the height of his powers, the Death Eaters outnumbered the Order ten 
to one, they were being killed off one by one, and LV was slowly 
taking over the world. There wasn't any hope that he could be 
stopped, it was an atmosphere of fear and suspicion that hung over 
the WW.
And in such circumstances, a change of allegiance to the losing side 
shows an immense amount of faith. Especially in an old man's chess 
pieces.
And I think in order to change sides, he must have had not only 
faith in DD but hope that the losing side would win, hope that he 
would not get caught out by LV.
This would have rested a lot on his Occlumency skills, so he would 
have had to have faith in his own Occlumency powers, and faith that 
he was taking a "great personal risk" for the plans made by a DD, 
which he trusted, would not fail.
So I guess in order to do that, he must have had to believe the best 
of Dumbledore.

Of course all this relies heavily on DD's man!Snape, so completely 
useless if you're an OFH theorist. 
Thought Id have a crack at it anyway.
Elyse