Snape and Gollum WAS: Re: Harry and Snape's redemption

[Joe Goodwin]

No: HPFGUIDX 150947

  

Don:


I am not a Snape lover, but like Gollum, Spape's actions and motives 
are often misread and confused by both the heros and readers. 
   
  Joe: 
I'm not sure about this. I think for the most part everybody gets Snapes actions, he's a jerk. Even though who think he is poor tortured Snape admit this. really the only confusion is if he is a jerk who fights Voldemort or a jerk who fights for Dumbledore.
   
  Don: 
I 
believe Snape and Gollum are often confused themselves, and as the 
primary heros of the story, Harry and Frodo, become more aware of the 
Snape's and Gollum's childhood, etc. become more compassionate and 
understanding – as does the reader.  Frodo on many occasions, 
acknowledging the twisted evil of Gollum, also empathizes with heim, 
sparing or causing others to spare Gollum's life.  Harry has not yet 
with Snape, but I anticipate he will, assuming also as I do, that 
Snape is fighting against Voldemort.  

Gollum and Snape's character, motives and actions are interestingly 
parallel.  Both are despised by most; however each finds acceptance 
that motivates them too uncharacteristic acts in support of others 
and the common good.  Both find acceptance however.  Gollum is 
accepted by Frodo, Snape is trusted and accepted by Dumbledore.  In 
return both take on incredible risk to return this acceptance, 
regardless that their true nature remain cruel and self-centered.
   
  Joe:
 I think it is safe to say that Gollum is never working for or with Frodo. Even in his very short Smeagol relapse he is doing what he has to do to get closer to the ring.

Don:
Both are striving in parallel with the goals of the hero, but each 
are not destined to be successful.
   
  Joe:
 Sorry but Frodo's and Gollum's goal aren't even close to each other. Frodo wants to destroy the ring amd Gollum wants to hoard it.
   
   
   Don: 
Gollum seeks unwittingly to 
prevent Sauron from re-obtaining the ring by the mistaken goal of 
retrieving the ring for himself.  Snape would avenge Lily, by getting 
close enough to kill Voldemort or destroy the Horcruxes - an almost 
impossible task. 
   
  Joe:
 Maybe you can answer this because I still haven't gotten a good answer for this. What in canon makes you think that Snape wants to avenge Lilly? Besides the pensieve scene I can't remember one single other thing and that one thing is a pretty flimsey things to base this on. He wants to avenge her death because she was once not horrible to him? As I said before if this is evidence then I am a Hermione/Grawp shipper because she was once kind to Grawp as well.
   
   
   Don:
  Both are obsessed, paranoid and twisted enough 
think they can accomplish it themselves.  

I suppose the question is; Are Gollum and Snape heros?  I suggest 
both are willing, to stand up to the power and evil of Sauron and 
Voldemort respectively, while many others are content to stand by the 
wayside - a good qualifier of heroism.
   
  Joe:
Gollum never stand up to Sauron. Gollum chases the ring because he is a junkie.
   
   
   Don:
 This fact, however, avoids 
their motives, so their identification as a heros is suspect.   If 
not heros, anti-heros maybe?  I, however believe they at least act 
heroically, acting outside of their self-interests at critical 
junctures, furthering the causes of their respective heros.
   
  Joe:
 Sorry but I don't see how either one of them is acting outside their own best interests. Gollum is an addict chasing his fix and Snape is (IMHO) following the only path that prevents him from being a slave to Voldemort forever.
   
  Joe