[HPforGrownups] Re: OFH SNAPE was: Script from JKR's reading/ About Snape and Dumbledore

[Marion Ros]

No: HPFGUIDX 156981

Renee:
>>>Are you suggesting Snape is *afraid* of Lupin until he's drunk his
Wolfsbane Potion? But if that's the case, then how do you explain
Snape's actions in the Shrieking Shack? If making Lupin drink his
potion was so all-important to him, he wouldn't have wasted precious
time acting out his revenge game on Sirius in the Shack. <<<

Marion:
Well, *I'd* be terrified to be in the same building as a werewolf on the eve of a full moon even *without* having lived through the trauma of a werewolf attack. 
If I remember correctly, the whole Shrieking Shack episode, from Snape's end, looked like this: Snape enters Lupin's chambers with the potion. No Lupin. Lupin has left his rooms on the night of a full moon without his potion. On the desk there is a magical map, showing three children in at the Whomping Willow and Lupin speeding that way himself. Snape, in possession of a brain and memory, instantly knows that Black must be hiding in the Shrieking Shack. Snape was convinced for that whole year that Lupin was aiding the escaped convict, the convicted murderer Black, after all. Which Lupin did (or at least he held his mouth about Black being an animagus and about the Marauder's map, about this being the way Black used to enter Hogwarts and stand above Ron's bed with a knife etc.).
Snape could've whistled down a Dementor at that moment, point to the Shrieking Shack, say "they're in there, guv'nor" and get praise from the whole WW, but for one pesky thing: the three children are trapped between a mass-murder and his buddy, the manical, soon to transform, werewolf.
Snape legs it to the Shrieking Shack.

Now, he *could* perhaps run to the Shack, holding a goblet of potion, enter the Shack, give the accomplice of a murderer the goblet (hope it didn't spill on the way, well, he did slow down a bit so it wouldn't spill... hope the kids aren't killed yet) saying something like, "Here you are, Lupin, your wolfsbane. Please drink it so you won't turn into a snarling monster. You don't want to tear these kiddies to shreds, do you? Well, you're here as the aider and abetter of Black, who is here to kill off the last of the Potters, mad traitorous murderer that he is, so I suppose you're going to kill the kiddies and me in a spot anyway, but you *much* rather be killing us whilst looking human, hm?"
Or, he could leave the potion, leg it to the Shack, hold the murderer and his minion at wand-point, get the kids out of there and deal with the two dastardly villains when the kids are out of danger.

He does the last.

Alas, no good deed ever goes unpunished. Whilst trying to get Harry Potter to safety, Harry, being Harry (i.e. stubborn, disobedient and stoopid) won't budge (doesn't know how dangerous Lupin is. Doesn't know how dangerous Black is. Does know he resents his ugly, strict, sarcastic teacher and likes to disobey him on principle alone). 

Now, if *I* were Snape, I would've AK-ed both Black and Lupin in a second. I'd probably get a reward for Black ('dead or alive', wasn't it?) and bagging his werewolf helper on a night of a full moon can't be seen as murder, surely. But Snape has but one priority: getting the kids out of there and subdueing Black and Lupin.
Now maybe Snape thought that death was too good for them. Snape nurses a grudge against them after all, and people who hold a grudge are concerned with *justice*. They've got to *pay* for their crimes. Killing them would be too easy. 
Perhaps.
Perhaps Snape is just too civilised to just come in and start killing people, no matter how heinous. Maybe he needs a little more justification ("don't make me do it, Black!") before he starts blasting two men in front of the kiddies.
Maybe.
But we do know that Snape wants the kids *out* of there. Fast.

Harry and his friends then do the unthinkable. Instead of obeying their rescuer, they *attack* him!



Renee:
>>>What I see in the scene with Harry is a man trying to assert his hold on someone who depends on his goodwill. But Lupin doesn't play along.  And I don't see why he should - it wasn't his fault that he nearly killed Snape. I could see Lupin reason that if he meekly consents to do what Snape tells him, it might leave Snape with the impression he's admitting his guilt. And as he doesn't like Snape, he's not going to please him. Also, if you're dependent on medicine, it both galling and humiliating to have someone you don't like tell you to take it and actually trying to supervise you doing so. Especially before a witness who also happens to be a student of yours. <<<


Marion:
I see a man who is dangerous getting a job as a teacher on the stict condition that he takes his medicine. He would be too much of a danger to the children otherwise. Wanna bet that Dumbledore gave Snape the order "You will brew his this potion, Severus, and you will see to it that he *drinks* it. I won't endanger the children, but that means he *must* take it. You above all others know how dangerous Lupin can be, dear boy.."
Wouldn't surprise me if the reason to hire Lupin in the first place was so Dumbledore could lure the escaped convict Black to the school, either. Harry was already there. With Lupin added, Hogwarts would've been irresistable for Black.

People in the fandom tend to see werewolves as AIDS patients: shunned, harmless, misunderstood.
Red Hen likenes Lupin to a schizophrenic, who doesn't want to take his medicine because it makes him feel unlike himself.
I tend to liken them to pedophiles. 

Yes, that's a nasty thing to say, but I'm saying it to make a point. I'll explain further on. And no, I'm not in any way claiming that Lupin abuses children. He *does* endanger them, however. But it's the 'victim' status that I want to tackle, and pedophilia is a good way to go at it because pedophilia is seen as a disease and yet at the same time the public has no compassion for a pedophile.

They say pedophilia is a disease which makes men (and women, but we hear less of them) prey on children. There are drugs that can suppress sexual excitement. It won't 'cure' pedophiles of their hunger for children, but it 'lulls the beast'.
Now suppose a young boy got accosted at school once by one of those beasts. It was hushed up, of course, the school didn't need the bad publicity. Twenty years later, the boy has become a teacher and lo and behold, his one time accoster turns up as an interim teacher as well. The head of the school, knowing of the new teacher's 'affiction', agrees to hire him on the condition that he takes drugs to 'curb his urges'. The one to administer them to him is his one-time victim, because a) he makes the stuff and b) the matter was hushed up; not many know of the man's affliction.
Now, picture the whole scene again, with this in mind.

One-time victim of pedophile teacher comes to bring him drugs to render him temporarily safe for the children he has to teach.
Pedophile teacher gives 'special lessons' to a boy, who's there when one-time victim enters with the medicine.
Pedophile teacher looks his one-time victim in the face, smiles, and says, "Oh, just put it there. I will take it when you're gone."

Doesn't sound *half* as nice anymore, does it?

No, I'm not saying Lupin is a pedophile, nor that he wants to do anything with Harry. I'm just trying to look at what *really* happens without letting preconceived notions cloud my eyes.

There have been studies which prove that how a person is introduced matters to how that person continues to be perceived. If a person is introduced as 'Tom Brown, who murdered his father when he was 17, is very kind to his aged, silver-haired mother and who is an active member of the Association for Protection of Helpless Kittens', we tend to think Tom Brown a filthy fathermurder, a youthful delinquent who is possibly pulling the wool over our eyes with that silver-haired mother and those kittens. The hypocrite!
If he is introduced as 'Tom Brown, who is very kind to his aged, silver-haired mother and who is an active member of the Association for Protection of Helpless Kittens, and who murdered his father when he was 17', we tend to see him as a kind man who probably had good reasons to kill his father. Probably the father was a drunk and abused the poor mother (that's why her hair is prematurely grey, of course!)

Lupin is introduced to us as a kind, patient softspoken man who takes frights away from children and who deals out chocolates, but who turns out to be a werewolf.
Snape is introduced as and ugly man with a hooked nose, who is strict and sarcastic and who has no patience for fools. A man dressed in black, who looks scary and acts scary. And he rescues and protects the children in his care.

No matter what he does, how many self-serving lies he tells, no matter how neglectful he is (both in his potiontaking as in his care for Harry: how often does he send Harry, the son of his dear good friend, a letter or some sort of message when Harry is all alone at the Dursleys or at school, fretting about things? Never? Well, whadayaknow), no matter what, we still tend to see Lupin as a kind man, a victim of his affliction. Persecuted for being 'different'. Being the only werewolf we have seen, he become the yardstick for all werewolves. All werewolves, we think, must be kind, and maltreated, and suffering from abuse, persecution and misconception.

And then Fenrir Greyback homed into view.

That was a shock!

And then it turned out that werewolves tended to take after Fenrir more than after Lupin.
And really, was Lupin ever *really* concerned about the possible death and injury he could inflict? He seems rather flippant in PoA when he reminisces about his schooldays, roaming around with his animagus friends, laughing in retrospect about how *dangerous* it was to break his promise to Dumbledore and run free as a werewolf ("there were a few narrow escapes").
And *still* people see Lupin as a kind, patient softspoken man who wouldn't hurt a fly.

Personally, I'd prefer the crabby, nasty, ugly man who protects my children instead of endangers them. Who tells the cold hard unpopular truth instead of lying to make himself look better. But hey! That's just me :-)