Harry Forgiving Snape / Grey!Snape and Character Growth

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 162956

Carol:
> But what I'm talking about here is the *labels.* When we use a
> label like DDM!Snape, we're not talking about Harry or what Harry
> will have to get past to understand the complex person that is 
> Snape, including his remorse, his suffering, his loyalty, etc. When
> we use the DDM!Snape label on this list, we're talking about Snape,
> and the key question is where Snape's loyalties lie.
 
SSSusan:
> Okay, I see the point you're making.  ESE!Snape, OFH!Snape and DDM!
> Snape each speak to what proponents believe *about Snape,* not 
> necessarily about what they feel Harry would have to do or think in 
> order to come to terms with that particular version of Snape.  I 
> understand why Grey!Snape as a label *in the same grouping* would 
> be troublesome.
> 
> I think that simply means it's unfortunate, then, that it's grouped 
> with those other three, then! <g>  Because as a theory of what 
> might be to come, Grey!Snape is a nice one, imo.

Ceridwen:
> So, what you're saying is that Grey!Snape, to you, is what Harry
> sees and has to deal with? That's an interesting perspective. I 
> like it, if it is what you're saying.

Jen:  I think some background information may help here.  Way back 
when I wrote my first Grey post, which was almost a year ago, I 
looked at the loyalty issues and trust issues as *well* as character 
issues.  Debbie liked the post and chimed in with a version she'd 
written that also dealt with the loyalty issue.  Grey lasted one 
thread and was dropped.  So when Debbie picked up the discussion 
again recently, she naturally started with the issue of loyalty 
because that's the point the theory had evolved to when last 
discussed (and because loyalty also continues to be part of her 
thinking as she mentioned last night).

As the most recent discussion evolved, and Grey was a theory in 
progress which meant it got messy, I found myself realizing the 
loyalty issue was not at the heart of Grey!Snape for *me*.  That I 
was proposing Snape as grey in the sense of his morality (for lack of 
a better word) and philosophy about the WW at large.  That he could 
be loyal to Dumbledore and completely devoted to defeating Voldemort 
while having some OFH characteristics *too*, that he's not 
black/white.  Snape didn't completely embrace Voldemort's philosophy 
imo or when LV targeted the Potters he wouldn't have batted an 
eyelash or felt remorse or considered turning.  In that same vein, I 
don't believe Snape completely embraces Dumbledore's view of the WW 
even though his loyalty is beyond reproach.  

I turned to Harry's POV at that point and Grey became something other 
than a Snape loyalty theory, meaning it couldn't be grouped in the 
DDM/OFH/ESE mix.  Which doesn't mean there's not a place for a grey 
Snape  the *character* within DDM, as Susan pointed out!

Jen