Is Snape good or evil?

[zgirnius]

No: HPFGUIDX 148604

> > Dungrollin:
> > 
> > Depends what your assumptions are. If you think that 
> > 
> > a) Voldemort *had* told Snape about Draco's task (canon, unless 
> > Snape was lying)
> > b) Snape and DD discussed Draco's task before Bella and Cissy's 
> > visit (perfectly plausible, given that DD knew about it on the 
> tower)
> > c) The last clause of the Unbreakable Vow was a complete surprise 
> to 
> > Snape; he was snookered and had to accept (the twitch)
> > d) He immediately told DD what had happened (DD was not surprised 
> > about the UV when Harry told him)
<SNIP> 
> Alla:
> 
> Yes, it is depends on what our assumptions are, doesn't it? I still 
> do not see any evidence of Snape informing Dumbledore about third 
> clause of the UV. I mean, he could have done that, sure, but 
correct 
> me if I am wrong, you seem to agree that Snape WAS stupid to take 
> the Vow, because of the third clause, no? I apologise if I am 
> reading you incorrectly, but if I am reading you correctly and 
Snape 
> is at that moment either wavering or loyal to DD, when Snape EVER 
> admits in canon that he is wrong about something?
<snippety-snip>
zgirnius:
If we take Dumbledore's word for it (and I know you prefer not to 
<g>) Snape makes an exception for Dumbledore in this area.

That aside, you seem to be disregarding b) of Dungrollin's post. If 
Voldemort told Snape about the task, and that he would be needing to 
do it at some point, it would be discussed in this hypothetical 
meeting. Depending on what was decided at that meeting the mistake of 
taking the Vow might not be such a big one. Dumbledore's decision to 
give Snape DADA seems to indicate Dumbledore's preferred solution to 
the eventual problem of Snape being assigned to kill him would 
involve Snape leaving Hogwarts under bad circumstances. This jives 
better with 'superspy Snape' than 'OK, Snape, you've done well, 
thanks, now it is time to hide you away so completely Voldemort will 
never find you'.

Alla:
> Having said all that, I wonder about your take on whether Snape was 
> lying or telling the truth in general in Spinner's End. If you 
argue 
> that Voldemort told Snape about Draco's task is true, doesn't it 
> strengthen ESE!Snape argument? He knows what Draco task is and 
STILL 
> takes the Vow? I mean, Okay you argue that third clause was a 
> surprise, but still - agreeing to protect Draco while little shmuck 
> tries to kill Headmaster, isn't it a bit too close to being 
> accessory?

zgirnius:
I have previously been very much of the opinion Snape did not know 
the task. It was my first reaction to Spinner's End, and I can 
certainly still see it, but the idea he did, and had already 
discussed the problem with Dumbledore, is beginning to grow on me. 
Because it is an additional reason for Dumbledore to give him DADA 
that year. The knowledge that Snape is going to be ordered to kill 
him possibly by the end of this year would make it necessary to 
implement the 'superspy' plan now rather than later.

Now, how are Dumbledore and Snape planning to deal with their basic 
problem, assuming they HAVE discussed it? Either by having Snape 
actually kill Dumbledore, or by having Snape fake it well enough to 
convince Voldemort. I would tend to rule out the first option as 
senseless, and out of character for Dumbledore, UNLESS his days were 
already numbered for other reasons. (The ring curse...I think 
Dumbledore's condition was stable, but I do see it as an outside 
chance that I am wrong in this. And if I am, I definitely buy the 
planned killing scenario). But more likely, they would be planning to 
fake the killing.

To fake the killing (and also to save Draco, which would be another 
objective for Dumbledore) it would be useful for Snape to know more 
about the specifics of Draco's plan. Taking a Vow to protect and 
watch over Draco has the potential to gain the trust of Draco and/or 
his family in this matter, and also provides Snape with a DE-worthy 
motive for his interest in the specifics. 

Alla:
> I mean, I will be VERY happy to learn that everything that Snape 
> said in Spinner's End was true, but that would mean that blood of 
> Emmeline Vance and Sirius is on his hands.

zgirnius:
Gee. And maybe it was just a skillful mix of lies, truths, and half-
truths. That actually seems most likely to me. (And good luck to us 
all figuring out which was which!)