Snape at GH? (Was: Snape Loved or In-Love with Lily?)

[exodusts]

No: HPFGUIDX 148803

> Sydney:
> It's not so much that Snape COULDN'T have acted so convincingly 
upset,
> so much as, why would you want to turn a great scene with so much
> genuine emotion and tragedy, into "GOTCHA! he was just pretending, 
no
> real drama here, folks". *is mystified*  

Exodusts:
For the shock of the cunning twist? Further, I don't think that a 
later revelation would at all detract from the power of the earlier 
scene when it is being read.


> Sydney:
> Well, yeah.  Sort of like, I prefer this building to be supported by
> iron t-bars, rather than balsa wood!  JKR is a superb plotter in 
that
> she rests the weight of the story structure on exquisitely opposed 
and
> powerful motivations.  If you jump up and down on a motivation, and 
it
> snaps, you pretty much have to discard it as a theory.

Exodusts:
Agree, but don't quite see the relevance.


> Sydney:
> It's canon that Snape turned spy before Lily died-- unless 
Dumbledore
> was lying for some reason in the Pensive scene in OoP.  He testifies
> that Snape 'returned to our side' BEFORE V-mort's fall.  Otherwise,
> not only would Dumbledore be lying, there would have to be a mystery
> OTHER spy to have tipped off the Potters to the danger they were in,
> as per Fudge in PoA.

Exodusts:
Since Fudge specifically says DD had a "number of useful spies", that 
isn't a problem. And why shouldn't DD lie (in GoF, by the way, not 
OotP) if he knows it will protect a now-repentant Snape from Azkaban? 
But, quite apart from all that, you appear to be assuming that Snape 
becoming DD's spy = Snape becoming DDM. Not if he was ordered to 
start "spying" for DD by Voldemort, and he was a double agent until 
the horror of Lily's death made him properly a good guy. It all 
depends upon your view of Snape's wavering loyalties. As someone once 
said: Treason is a matter of dates?


> Sydney:
> Again, this is pretty explicity against canon, again, unless
> Dumbeldore is lying.  He says Harry would have no idea of the 
remorse
> Snape felt "WHEN HE DISCOVERED HOW VOLDEMORT INTERPRETED THE
> PROPHECY".  The Potters went into hiding before they died;  so Snape
> would have known who V-mort was targeting before he actually killed 
them.

Exodusts:
See above.


> Sydney:
> I just don't see how it's remotely in character for Voldemort to be
> sparing the lives of his enemies as a favour to the softer feelings 
of
> one of his minions.  It rather seems to me like an instant death
> sentence for Snape to even suggest such a thing.  The only thing I 
can
> picture is Snape successfully putting on an act of wanting to 
revenge
> himself on James by violating Lily, which is a motive Voldemort 
could
> understand;  but how on earth JKR would introduce such an idea into
> the story, which so far has maintined a PG, nudge*nudge*wink*wink,
> rating is hard for me to imagine.  

Exodusts:
We know LV made the offer to Lily, so we know that he didn't care 
that much if she lived or died. That being so, it isn't a leap to say 
that Snape might make a request that affects him a lot, but doesn't 
affect LV much one way or the other.


> Sydney:
> By the way, is there a reason, aside from JKR's evasiveness in
> answering questions, to think there was anyone else at Goderic's
> Hollow?  Even if Snape was there in a white leotard trying to save
> Lily, I still wouldn't be enthusiastic about it!  It seems to me the
> central mystery of the series narrows down to the crucible 
containing
> Lily, Voldemort, and Harry;  everyone else, including Snape, is one
> circle out in importance.  JKR might write someone else in, but at 
the
> moment I don't see why.  

Exodusts:
Her evasiveness is a pretty strong hint when you consider her track 
record, and policy on declarations. As for it being Snape - haven't 
you noticed how he is creeping in to the bigger picture with each 
successive book? Book 6 was even titled after him! Isn't Snape's-bad 
vs Snape's-good now the central mystery of the series?