[HPforGrownups] Re: Harry Horcrux redux :)

[Peggy Wilkins]

No: HPFGUIDX 155028

On 7/7/06, esmith222002 <c.john at imperial.ac.uk> wrote:

Brothergib:
> I just thought I would add a bit about the Horcrux timelines. First
> of all, I believe DD when he says that LV was going to use Harry's
> death to make his final Horcrux. Therefore, when LV entered Godric's
> Hollow he must have been in possession of 5 Horcruxes.

Peggy W:
Dumbledore himself makes two (slightly) contradictory statements about
this in the HBP "Horcruxes" chapter.  He says:

<<HBP p.506>>
"...if my calculations are correct, Voldemort was still at least one
Horcrux short of his goal of six when he entered your parents' house
with the intention of killing you.
   "He seems to have reserved the process of making Horcruxes for
particularly significant deaths.  You would certainly have been that.
He believed that in killing you, he was destroying the danger the
prophecy had outlined.  He believed he was making himself invincible.
I am sure that he was intending to make his final Horcrux with your
death."
<<end quote>>

So he first says Voldemort was "at least one Horcrux short" which
expresses some uncertainty about whether he already had 4 or 5
Horcruxes as he entered the Potter house; then he says "I am sure that
he was intending to make his final Horcrux with your death" which
seems to indicate certainty that there were already 5 Horcruxes... My
dear Dumbledore, which is it?

One way out of this, I suppose, is to presume that if he only had 4,
he then immediately used James' death to make Horcrux number 5.  I
don't see when he could have had time to do this (perhaps after Lily's
murder, but before the attempt on Harry?), but it's possible.  In that
case Harry's death could certainly have been used to make the sixth
and final Horcrux.

If that happened, then we have to ask where is Horcrux #5: it would
probably have been abandoned at Godric's Hollow.  Interesting
possibility, although I will add that I am not confident that this
scenario was at all likely.

> The first four
> must be the diary (created whilst he was at Hogwarts), the ring
> (created probably with the death of his father), the locket & the cup
> (created before GH). As to the fifth Horcrux - it has to be Nagini.
> LV's snakelike appearance is surely evidence of this.

I think this does not follow.  Dumbledore states that he believes
Voldemort's altered appearance was due to his having damaged his soul
so severely: he went beyond "ordinary evil" in murdering so many times
and making his multiple Horcruxes, and his altered (severely damaged)
soul was reflected in an altered physical appearance.  About the
possibility of making Nagini into one of his Horcruxes, Dumbledore
says: "As we know, he failed [to kill you at Godric's Hollow].  After
an interval of some years, however, he used Nagini to kill an old
Muggle man, and it might then have occurred to him to turn her into
his last Horcrux."  (p.506 again)

So it is Dumbledore's belief that if Nagini is a Horcrux, she was made
into one "some years" after Godric's Hollow.  Actually if he is
talking about Frank Bryce's death, it would have been some 13 years
later.  (I will add that I've also been confused by Dumbledore's
statement that Voldemort "used" Nagini to kill this Muggle, because we
know that Voldemort used his own wand to AK Frank Bryce--so how was
Nagini "used" to kill him?)

> And if we
> follow the timeline - when LV talks to DD in the chapter 'Lord
> Voldemort's request' in HBP he is not yet snakelike. When he appears
> on the back of Quirrel's head, he is snakelike! He clearly would not
> be able to make a Horcrux as the ethereal being he has been since GH,
> therefore the Nagini horcrux was made before GH.

I don't believe this conclusion is correct for the reason given above:
Voldemort's appearance is explained without requiring him to have
Nagini as a Horcrux.

-- 
Peggy Wilkins
enlil65 at gmail.com