Harry & Slytherin (was:Re: Sorting Hat (was: muggle baiting vs. muggle torture)

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 155546

Triin:
> > What is it about Harry's personality that makes him so 
> > Slytherin that the hat had to be begged not to put him there? He 
> > is such a *straightfoward* person, with a "saving people thing", 
> > etc; to me he sounds like an epitome of Gryffindor values.. 
 
Betsy Hp:
> Huh.  I would never have thought to describe Harry 
> as "straightforward".  He strikes me as someone who plays his 
> cards very close to the vest, letting as few people in as 
> possible.  <snip>

SSSusan:
I can't speak for Triin, of course, but I wonder if what was meant 
by calling him a *straightforward* person is simply that he's not... 
I don't know... duplicitous?  He's not going to *consciously* tweak 
how he comes across to others.  He's not going to present one face 
to one person and another face to another, simply because he senses 
some benefit or advantage in doing so.  He's "just Harry," in other 
words.  He is who he is, and that's that.

But, yes, he *does* play his cards close to the vest.  And he is 
naturally an introvert.  I think those don't *not* fit with being 
straightforward.  Maybe you're thinking of straightforward in the 
sense of someone who's *forthright*?  But Triin may mean it more 
like this (from dictionary.com):

1. Not circuitous or evasive; honest and frank.  
2. Free from ambiguity or pretense; plain and open. 


Betsy Hp:
> Because of that I think Harry rather naturally goes a bit sneaky 
> when he wants to find something out.  I don't think it's an 
> accident that his two most important tools are a cloak that allows 
> him to disappear and map that allows him to silently spy.  Harry 
> likes to creep about rather than straightforwardly ask for 
> information.  

SSSusan:
This is a *great* insight into Harry's personality, imo.  So, okay, 
he is sneaky... but I still think he can be straightforward in that 
the sneakiness isn't really about pretense; it's about facility or 
necessity (as Harry sees it).  What I'm saying is that I think your 
comment here shows that your use of the word "straightforwardly" 
might well be more in line with "forthrightly" than with the "free 
from pretense, honest and frank" kind of definition.

 
Sherry:
> > I think Harry was meant to be in Gryffindor, and that
> > unlike what so many seem to see in that scene, it was never 
> > the Hat's second choice for Harry.
 
Betsy Hp:
> I don't know that Slytherin was the Hat's *first* choice for Harry 
> (Gryffindor may well have been).  But the Hat does seem to imply 
> that it's a *viable* choice, a House Harry could do well in.  

SSSusan:
I have always maintained that the hat never "wanted" to put Harry in 
Slytherin.  All it really does it tell Harry that he would do well 
there.  Yet Harry insists that he doesn't want Slytherin, and the 
hat goes along with this.  In my view, the hat simply wanted Harry 
to MAKE HIS OWN CHOICE.  It pointed out some benefits of other 
houses besides Gryffindor, but it never said, "Oh, not Gryffindor, 
Harry! I really want you to be in Slytherin!!" 

I think the hat simply "wanted" to highlight to Harry -- hoping that 
he would look back on it, eventually -- that it was truly about 
CHOICES.

Siriusly Snapey Susan