Phoenix fire?

[houyhnhnm102]

No: HPFGUIDX 154149

Tim:

> I am however not entirely convinced that selfishness is 
> any worse or better, as it acts as a driver in most situations - 
> yet is when not countered by the balancing of the care for the 
> other. I have absolutely no idea about the actual symbolizing 
> in this except drawing on kinda arbitrary feelings and senses 
> from the scenes that you're talking about.

houyhnhnm:

I would go further than that.  I am not sure that selfishness 
is a Slytherin trait at all. First of all, I agree with you that 
individual characters in the Harry Potter books have elements 
of all four houses in them, but I am also interested in what 
the characteristics of the pure type for each house would be, 
since those are the qualities that are going to be *nurtured* 
by the assignment to a particular house.  I think all four 
types are capable of being selfish, but the selfishness would
manifest itself in different ways according to the 
characteristics of the house type.

I was fascinated to read that Rowling associated the 
four Hogwarts Houses with the four elements because I
had been thinking along those lines myself.  Then we 
had the assertion by the Sorting Hat that the four 
houses must unify to defeat Voldemort and Rowling's 
words about the "idea of harmony and balance, that 
you had four necessary components and by integrating 
them you would make a very strong place".

I got out my old astrology books (I am a science teacher 
now and a Champion of the Rational Principle but once I 
dabbled in the Dark arts ;-) to look at the traits 
traditionally ascribed to each of the four elements.  
The problem was that I started with water and the 
descriptors didn't seem to fit.  

That's why I turned to look at the characteristics 
of individual water signs.  And Scorpio descriptors 
really do seem to fit the Slytherin characters that 
we have seen, especially the lowest, least evolved 
sub-type (Scorpion) who is avaricious, feeds on other 
people's weakness, totally self-seeking.  The middle 
sub-type (Eagle) seems to correspond well with Slughorn's 
character.  He is self-seeking and self-indulgent.He 
uses other people's resources, but does at least try 
to do so in a way that brings mutual benefits.

Below I have compiled a list of positive and negative 
traits associated with the four elements.  I started 
with fire this time and left water for last.

*****
Fire:
Positive--Optimististic, exhuberant, adventuresome, 
always ready for what is new and never afraid to face hazards.
Negative--reckless, overconfident, proud, arrogant and 
lacking in sympathy for the weak.
*****
Air:
Positive--intellectual, refined, idealistic, humane.
Negative--superficial, loquacious, aloof and cold, 
nervous, divorced from the real and practical.
*****
Earth:
Positive--practical, reliable, hardworking, responsible, 
dutiful.
Negative--materialistic, commonplace, narrowly utilitarian, 
a slave to routine and law and order.
*****
Water:
Positive--prudent, compassionate, understanding, artistic,
 protective, sensitive, reserved, seeking to help others.
Negative--suspicious, self-repressed, hysterical, 
self-indulgent, seeking to gain control over others, 
exaggerating feelings all out of proportion.
*****

You see the problem.  The first three sets of descriptors 
accord pretty well with what we have seen of Gryffindor, 
Ravenclaw, and Hufflepuff.

The last set makes you go, "Huh?" Compassionate?  Protective?  
Sensitive?  Seeking to help others? Slytherins? That's 
what made me think that maybe we are supposed to see something 
of the most evolved Slytherin characteristics in Fawkes.  
That and the fact that the phoenix is asscociated with the
water sign Scorpio.