LID!Snape rides again (was: High Noon for OFH!Snape)

[quick_silver71]

No: HPFGUIDX 149788

> > >>Jen:
> > > <snip>
> > > The mouse in the trap, the fly in the web--Voldemort 
found      
> > > Snape's weakness once again as he did the first time 
Snape       
> > > foolishly wore his heart on his sleeve, manipulating him 
into   
> > > the position of killing the Only One Who Ever Believed In Him.
> > > It's just so vintage Voldemort I don't get why people don't 
buy 
> > > this one. Would someone argue with me so I can understand 
the    
> > > objections to Voldemort being behind this plot? <snip>
> 
> > >>Carol:
> > <snip>
> > I see no way that Voldemort could consciously have engineered 
the 
> > UV and talked Narcissa (who is terrified that LV will kill 
Draco) 
> > into trapping Snape, nor do I see how word of the UV could 
have   
> > gotten back to him. Certainly, neither Bellatrix nor 
Narcissa     
> > would tell LV about the provisions involving Draco, which 
clearly 
> > violate LV's will. 
> > <snip>
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> I agree with Carol that, logistically, it makes sense that 
Voldemort 
> doesn't know about the Vow.  Another problem I have with Voldemort 
> using Narcissa to trap Snape into the Vow is that it weakens the 
> emotion going on in Spinner's End.  These three people (not 
> including Peter here since Snape threw him out) are going 
*against* 
> Voldemort.  They all realize this.
> 
> Narcissa is going against Voldemort to save her family.  She's a 
> wreck, and she's terrified, but she's intent on doing whatever she 
> can to save her son.
> 
> Bellatrix is going against Voldemort in her desperate need to 
> undermine Snape.  It's a nice bit of irony, but in her eagerness 
to 
> prove Snape's disloyalty she undertakes a bit of disloyalty 
> herself.  (I think she may also see a way back into Voldemort's 
good 
> graces with Draco's task and is attempting to keep Narcissa from 
> messing with her plan.  More irony. <g>)
> 
> Snape, of course, is totally disloyal to Voldemort and is willing 
to 
> do what it takes to prevent him from achieving his goals.  And if 
he 
> can tie the Malfoy family to Dumbledore's side, all the better.  
> Which means he's the least honest character in the room.
> 
> But Narcissa's fear and determination, Bellatrix's suspicions, 
those 
> all struck me as entirely honest.  I cannot see either woman 
playing 
> a deeper game here, so I cannot see Voldemort being behind the Vow.

I personally push the involvement of Voldemort back one step further

one of the reasons that he gave Draco his task was the chance the 
Narcissa would ask the Unbreakable Vow of Snape. Well it may sound 
strange and complicated (and likely untrue
but I like to speculate) 
in a way it makes sense to me for several reasons:

1)	The Narcissa angle: Voldemort gives her a son 
an "impossible" mission with the seeming intention to kill Draco. 
Narcissa's husband is in jail and the only person that can turn to 
help her son at Hogwarts is Snape. Voldemort has seen desperate 
mother's before (i.e. Lily) and well he may not understand the love 
that drives them I see no reason why he can't use it for his own 
ends (also one of Narcissa's emotions seems to be fear
something I 
think Voldemort does understand in his on way). Voldemort must know 
that Snape is a Malfoy family friend (Sirius certainly thought so) 
and as the only Death Eater in Hogwarts (that we know of) surely he 
must have realized that Narcissa would go Snape for help after 
learning of the mission.

2)	The Bellatrix angle: Utterly genuine I think.
 
3)	The Peter angle: Basically, IMO, if Voldemort's plan(s) all 
along was to set up the scene for an Unbreakable Vow then Peter's 
presence may make a little more sense. Peter wasn't there to check 
on Snape's loyalties or to gather hard information on what Snape was 
doing. He was there to note when Narcissa and a second person (in 
this case Bellatrix) visited Snape. And Snape went ahead and let 
Peter bring wine to the women and then caught him when he listened 
under the door. Peter wasn't listening under the door to spy on 
Snape, he only wanted Snape to think that so that Snape would think 
he was there to spy. 

4)	The CoS and GoF angle: In both CoS and GoF an assumption is 
made about Voldemort's plans
that there going to drive the 
muggleborns out of the school or that Harry was put in the 
tournament to be killed. So I don't see why that can't happen HBP as 
well, everyone assumes the plan is to punish the Malfoys when really 
it's about getting Snape to kill Dumbledore.

5)	The Endgame angle: By the end of HBP we know the standing of 
most the major characters, as in what they're planning on doing in 
the next book
the Trio is going Horcrux hunting, Snape and Draco 
will have to deal with the Tower incident among Voldemort's camp 
(although the hiding argument could also be made), and Dumbledore 
appears to be dead. The only character whose plans seem to be hidden 
are those of Voldemort. Two things could be happening, IMO
either a 
Voldemort plan will be revealed in book 7 (and remember JK has said 
that books 6 & 7 are like one novel) or Voldemort's plan in book 6 
was the "phase one" of his endgame plan. Throughout HBP I didn't 
really get the impression that they was a larger Voldemort plan at 
work in the wizarding world, the attacks seemed mostly to be random 
acts of violence. In OotP on the other hand the main Voldemort 
activity (and noticeable) seemed to be very focused
regroup (hence 
the breakouts) and get the prophecy. That to me implies that 
Voldemort's plan (after OotP) required the death of Dumbledore. And 
I simply can't see him having so much faith in Draco that he based 
all of his future plans on Draco's ability to kill Dumbledore

however it makes more sense if he knows Snape is going to have his 
hand forced (unless you mean to imply that Voldemort understand what 
Draco can do better then anyone except Harry). I guess what I'm 
saying it that Voldemort's plan in HBP seems to have been to kill 
Dumbledore and allow for the endgame to begin
and the only move he 
makes in that direction is sending Draco, who everyone thinks is 
being used to get revenge on Lucius. So I tend to think that he had 
reason, more then his faith in Draco, to think that Dumbledore was 
going to be dying soon (and I don't believe that the ring curse was 
killing Dumbledore
at least not until he had drank the potion) and 
Voldemort knowing about the UV would explain that faith. 

Quick_Silver (realizing that he's probably wrong)