Draco as Victim in GoF /Sectusemptra or not in Pensieve

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 150296

> Carol responds:
> 
> I agree that *if* this curse or hex is Sectum Sempra, Severus did 
a 
> remarkable job of controlling it under the circumstances and given 
his 
> emotional state.
> 
> 
> 
> Magpie:
> 
> What's gained by this not being Sectumsempra?  I mean, when I read 
it I 
> never thought it was anything else--I actually mistakently thought 
we 
> already knew the name of the curse Snape used against James so 
when I read 
> "Sectumsempra" and "for enemies" I said, "Oh, it's that razor 
blade spell 
> Snape used on James."  I guess I just logically thought that if 
Levicorpus 
> was the upsidedown spell of course the mystery spell Harry had 
seen before 
> too--JKR tends to work that way.
<SNIP>

Alla:

Oh, I also said that it was Sectusemptra right away and of course I 
don't think that Snape was exercising any kind of restraint. My 
first thought was that Snape simply did not develop the spell well 
enough yet by that time, so called "work in progress", you know, 
which became deadlier in time.

Speculating here, of course.

> Joe:
<SNIP> 
> Victim also implies powerlessness where in fact Draco and his ilk 
had to go out of their way to get beat down. Muggle law aside I have 
no doubt that Harry and pals did the absolutely right thing. People 
will treat you as you let them and Draco's little speach went way 
beyond tolerable. Some things cannot be borne and sometimes you have 
to stand up for your selves.

Alla:

Not only that, I just don't get how somebody who IMO literally ASKED 
for something bad to happen to him can be called a victim. I think 
maybe I am running into language problem again, but someone who is 
going to provoke people is not a victim in my book. He is a 
provocateur who got a bit more than he bargained for.

To me victim means "the innocent party". I have no problem calling 
Draco "physically injured party" for example, but victim ( and I am 
talking primarily morally, not legally) to me implies "wronged 
party".
    
I mean, even Draco positioning himself in the corridor of the train 
and screaming his death threats in order for the whole vagon to hear 
and Gryffs coming out of the appartment and hexing Draco would have 
have a bit more ambiguous to me. Like I can see argument that Draco 
was exercising his "free speech" right, although I agree that a good 
lawyer can make a case that this IS a hate speech and should not be 
allowed (of course as metaphor for RW, not word by word "mudblood"), 
etc.

But Draco invaded their space with his goons on his sides and their 
wands ready to be drawn out.

Yes, IMO Draco totally got what he asked for.

Alla,

laughs when she remembers arguments in defense of the Draco in this 
scene long time ago that he was really .... warning Hermione here 
that danger is coming, because he secretly likes her.