Scary Teachers - Good Teachers (was: Re: Hagrid and Snape...)

[Neri]

No: HPFGUIDX 152988

> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Basically then, you're arguing that all the other students in 
> Harry's class know more about what's going on at Hogwarts than Harry 
> does.

Neri:
Yup. Harry never knows about these things. And Ron, when it comes to
academic matters, is nearly as clueless as Harry. And both of them,
unlike other students, had much more important things on their minds.
I wouldn't put it past them to not read carefully through several
additional lines in their book list, or to miss a notice in the Daily
Prophet.

> Betsy Hp:
> With his strong, personal ties with Dumbledore. 

Neri:
When did Dumbledore ever help Harry or even just tip him off regarding
any academic matter? 

Not that he needed to. He obviously counted on McGonagall to take care
of these things. And she did.

> Betsy Hp:
> everyone else in Harry's class got a little note explaining that 
> NEWT Potions is now excepting "Exceeds Expectations".  Perhaps 
> McGonagall just failed to inform her Gryffindors while sending notes 
> out to all the other students?
> 
> It seems like an illogical set of conclusions to me.  There's a 
> sweet simplicity in just accepting the fact that only Harry and Ron 
> do not have Potions textbooks, so therefore only Harry and Ron 
> failed to make an Outstanding on their Potions OWL.
> 

Neri:
No, it's not simple, because then you have to ask yourself what
happened with all the rest of the students that got EE in their
potions OWL. Like Ron and Harry, they'd be informed in their first day
of the year that they *can* take the NEWT class after all. Potions is
a prestigious subject and a required NEWT for several high profile
jobs, such as Aurors and Healers, and the new potions master is an
influential man that has connections, opens a club and knows Gwenog
Johns. Logically there would be several other EE students with no
textbooks jumping on this golden opportunity, but somehow they never
arrive. Why? Perhaps McGonagall and all the other heads of houses just
failed to inform them? Or are Harry and Ron the only students in the
year that got EE in potions? It doesn't make sense. Much simpler to
assume that Ron and Harry just missed some notice that the others didn't. 

As any teacher knows from experience, grades generally follow
something close to a normal distribution. If there are X students with
the highest possible grade, there would normally be more students with
the next highest grade. JKR seems to be well aware of that: all the
grades she reports follow this pattern. DADA: one O (Harry) and three
EE (Ron, Hermione, Neville). Potions: one O (Hermione) and two EE
(Harry and Ron), etc. So if there were 10 students with potions
Outstanding, what happened to the 20 students or so with potions EE?


> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Actually, I think there's probably less than 40 students in Harry's 
> year.  

Neri:
Seeing as this number is canonically flinty canon, I prefer not use it
as the basis for any canon reasoning. My reasoning is based on
comparing the size of the potions NEWT class to the size of other NEWT
classes, and this has nothing to do with the total number of students
in Harry's year. IOW, if the potions NEWT class is 12/40 of the
students in this year, the DADA class is still 25/40 or more than
twice as much. Insert any number you like instead of 40 and this is
still true.


> 
> Betsy Hp:
> It'd be helpful if we knew what sort of requirement NEWT level DADA 
> made.  We know it's not as stringent as Potions, otherwise Ron and 
> Hermione wouldn't be in there.
> 

Neri:
The potions NEWT requirement during the HBP year is EE. Ron and
Hermione and Neville got into the DADA class with EE. Do you see Snape
adopting a lower standard than Slughorn and McGonagall for his new class? 

BTW, it is telling that Hermione achieved only an EE in the DADA OWL.
She produces a corporeal patronus, she took down several DEs in
battle, and she wouldn't have any trouble with the written part of the
exam, I'm sure. And yet she got only an EE. This suggests to me that
the exam is really difficult. If you're very good you'll get your EE,
but only the best of the best get Outstanding. 

Would Draco get an Outstanding in Potions? We have five years worth
information on him in potions class. Can you point me a single example
of him showing any excellence? You know, giving the right answer,
getting his potion to be the right color before the other students,
helping his friends, any of the things Hermione does five times in any
lesson. And no, just being a Slytherin doesn't count, and sucking up
to Snape doesn't either. 

Draco is similar to Harry in this regard. Harry too has never shown
any aptitude for potions in five years. If JKR told us in HBP that he
got an Outstanding in his potion OWL I would have said it's totally
unbelievable. EE yes, if he worked very hard, but not Outstanding. The
same is true for Draco. Except for Snape liking him we haven't seen
any evidence that he's a potions wiz.

 
> > >>Neri:
> > Overall, I get the quite consistent impression that the average    
> > NEWT class numbers 25-28 students, and the potions class is       
> > unusually small.
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Of course it is.  It's the most elite NEWT course that we've seen.  

Neri:

****************************************************************
HBP, Ch. 22:
Ernie was looking rather grumpy; determined to outshine Harry for
once, he had most rashly invented his own potion, which had curdled
and formed a kind of purple dumpling at the bottom of his cauldron.
Malfoy was already packing up, sour-faced; Slughorn had pronounced his
Hiccuping Solution merely "passable."
****************************************************************

If these are the elite, the WW is in trouble.


Neri