JKR and the boys

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 161487

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > First of all, Hermione doesn't have any female friends.  Ginny  
> > comes the closest (and I'll guess that Hermione would call Ginny 
> > her best girlfriend) but Ginny is a very far second to Ron and   
> > Harry.  Ginny might tell Hermione everything.  Hermione does not 
> > return the favor.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> Other than to trust her with the single juiciest bit of gossip in 
> all of Gryffindor Tower (The identity of Victor Krum's date to the 
> Yule ball).  This from a witch who is so good at keeping secrets   
> that her right hand has yet to be informed that she possesses a    
> left hand, much less what it's doing.

Betsy Hp:
Ah, but that's juicy gossip as per Hermione's roommates, the 
giggling girls.  It's not the sort of thing Hermione cares about, 
and the only reason she's keeping quiet about it is to annoy Ron.  
For Hermione, it's not a big secret.  (It's a big secret for Ron, 
but he's more into that sort of thing.)  But when it comes to 
Hermione's big secrets, Ginny doesn't know.  Neither do Ron or Harry 
for that matter.  Not until Hermione wants them to know.  Hermione 
is actually pretty self-sufficient.  I get the sense that she's used 
to, or well able to handle, being by herself.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> The idea that Ginny is not a close friend of Hermione is
> insupportable, even if she doesn't tell Ginny other people's      
> secrets; she doesn't tell anybody else other people's secret's    
> either.

Betsy Hp:
Yes, but my point was that Hermione doesn't share *her* secrets with 
Ginny.  Not any big ones, anyway.  And I'm not even saying that 
Ginny isn't a friend to Hermione.  I'm talking about her status, and 
Ginny definitely comes *after* Ron and Harry.  Which is fine.  But 
it makes it hard to say that the relationship between Ginny and 
Hermione is a good example of two close girlfriends.  Neither of the 
two seem to find having a close girlfriend all that important.

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > As to her sorting out Harry's love life:  I think she picked up 
> > all of her information on Cho either in the girls' restroom     
> > (*prime* source of that sort of gossip) or may have quizzed      
> > Lavender and Parvati.  But I'm quite sure Hermione did not       
> > figure out all of Cho's issues on her own.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> Because *Hermione Granger* the smartest witch of her generation,   
> isn't going to have any contacts in *Ravenclaw*, nor any insight   
> into the rest of the "smart crowd".  Betsy, think that through.

Betsy Hp:
Exactly.  As the beginnings of the DA club show us.  It might seem 
logical that the smart chick hangs with the smart kids.  But as per 
the books, she doesn't.  She hangs with Ron and Harry.  

And honestly, since the Gryffindors don't have a single class with 
the Ravenclaws (IIRC), it's not too hard to imagine that Hermione 
knows very little about individuals within Ravenclaw house.

And really, (thinking things through as you've urged me to do, 
Amiable Dorsai, <g>) how on earth would Hermione, with her lack of 
interest in quidditch, have any sort of special understanding about 
Cho's flying record?  Are we supposed to assume Hermione has been 
watching the Ravenclaw games avidly over the years and recognizes 
that Cho isn't flying up to her usual game and is so very interested 
she can't rest until she figures out why?

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> <snip>
> Recently, you described Ron as "the original H/G shipper".  I'm   
> not so sure you haven't nominated the wrong member of the trio for 
> that role.

Betsy Hp:
Hmm, was Hermione rooting for H/G earlier than Ron?  It wouldn't 
surprise me if Ginny *told* Hermione that she was hoping Harry asked 
her to the Yule Ball.  But that just signals awareness of a crush.  
Something Ron cottoned onto as early as CoS (possibly even PS/SS).

And Hermione's attitude during GoF seemed much more "goodness this 
boy and girl thing is soo silly" than "this is what hopes and dreams 
are made of!<3!).  For some reason I've always seen Ron as the first 
of the trio to hit sexual awareness or to suddenly realize that boys 
and girls will pair off eventually.

So I think I'll stick to Ron as the original H/G shipper.  But I'm 
open to argument. <g>

> >>Miles:
> > <snip>
> > But do we see groups of boys hanging around, talking or         
> > fighting, like in the PoA film scene mentioned? Rarely - but     
> > real boys do have social interactions with their peer groups,   
> > not only girls.
> > <snip>

> >>Shelley:
> I think you are looking at Harry and Ron, and maybe missing Malfoy 
> and his gang. Boys do fight, and such, and we definitely see that 
> with Dudley and his gang, and with Malfoy and his gang. Harry and 
> Ron don't get into fights? Baloney- they are tempted to in the    
> many scenes when Malfoy confronts them...
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Not to speak for Miles, but I was under the impression he wasn't 
talking full out fighting with intent to really harm, but the sort 
of playful tussling that boys will often engage in with their 
friends.  (Which is what the PoA film scene shows.)

It's the kind of thing I think Harry and Ron *would* get into with 
their dormmates (towel fights, wrestling matches, king of the castle 
type stuff) and certainly with each other.  Ron, with his many 
brothers, would automatically start that sort of behavior, I'd 
think.  And I doubt Harry is so socially maimed that he wouldn't 
join in.

JKR doesn't write any such scenes into the books.  The movie 
directors (and if I remember some interviews correctly, the actors) 
have thrown such interactions into the films.  However, I'm not sure 
I'd say that JKR didn't write such scenes in because she's unaware 
of boys' normal behavior.

Within the books I don't think there's a single interaction that 
doesn't somehow go towards the plot.  The only reason we get 
giggling groups of girls is because it hampers Harry's ability to 
approach Cho.  There's not a reason to show what Harry and his 
dormmates get up to because it doesn't go towards the plot.

[Though there's that scene in OotP when Harry realizes that Seamus 
thinks he's probably lying about Voldemort.  It's not a friendly 
scene but I thought it played out fairly true to how boys interact.  
What was interesting (to me, anyway) was Ron's easy assumption of 
power there.]

I think we're supposed to read those types of scenes in whenever Ron 
and Harry go flying together at the Burrow, or when the guys 
disappear into their dorms at night and Harry's not stressed out 
about something.  Kind of like bathing -- we don't see Harry do it, 
but we assume it's happened.

Betsy Hp