JKR and the boys (and girls)

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 161529

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > <snip>
> > But when it comes to Hermione's big secrets, Ginny doesn't know.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> You keep writing things like that.  Why do you think so?
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Hermione doesn't tell Ginny about figuring out Rita Skeeter's 
secret, capturing her, or her big plan to have Rita write Harry's 
story up.  Ginny seems to find out about the DA club along with 
everyone else (after Ron and Harry).  There's nothing to suggest 
Ginny knew about the contract being hexed.

Ginny wasn't involved at all in Hermione's attempt to save Buckbeak, 
even after Ron and Harry bowed out for a bit.  Ginny isn't involved 
in Hermione's SPEW (wasn't Neville the only other person Hermione 
was able to get involved?). 

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > <snip>
> > Hermione is actually pretty self-sufficient. I get the sense    
> > that she's used to, or well able to handle, being by herself.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> Able to handle being alone?  I dunno, the little girl who ran into
> that loo was desperate to have friends.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Oh, I'm not suggesting Hermione doesn't need or want friends.  She 
was very keen on befriending Harry and (most especially?) Ron.  But 
when Hermione has a plan or an idea of some sort, she very rarely 
feels the need to bounce it off of somebody or have someone come 
along and help her with it.  

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> Is it a Cho-Marietta kind of friendship?  Obviously not--         
> Hermione's no Cho, Ginny's no Marietta--but surely you're not     
> going to tell me that that's the only kind of close friendship    
> women can have; if you did, I wouldn't believe you.  My wife, my  
> sisters, female friends of mine, all seem to have many varieties   
> of close friendships.  Ginny and Hermione's, as I see it, would    
> fit right in.

Betsy Hp:
I'm not arguing that there's only one way of writing close female 
friendship.  What I am saying is that I don't see evidence that 
Hermione and Ginny are *close* female friends.  Whatever the manner 
or means.  In many ways I'd label them "friendly" rather 
than "friends". 

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> Granted, that her Lost Boys rank pretty high on Wend... erm,
> Hermione's priority list, how is it that her friendship with Ginny 
> is so insignificant that you can write, as you did, that "First of 
> all, Hermione doesn't have ANY female friends."?  (emphasis mine) 
> You uhm, weasleyed that a bit in your next sentence but still, it 
> seems rather broad.

Betsy Hp:
Of the girls in Hogwarts the closest Hermione comes to having a 
female friend is her relationship with Ginny.  But, they don't seem 
all that close (for the reasons and the canon I stuck up above).  So 
when it's suggested that Hermione *does* have tons of female 
friends, I question. 

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > As to her sorting out Harry's love life: I think she picked up
> > all of her information on Cho either in the girls' restroom
> > (*prime* source of that sort of gossip) or may have quizzed
> > Lavender and Parvati. But I'm quite sure Hermione did not
> > figure out all of Cho's issues on her own.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> <snip>
> And then, of course, there's the Prefect network.  You suggested   
> that Hermione overheard gossip about Cho in the girl's room.  Quite
> plausible, but I'd suggest it was the Prefects Bathroom where the 
> real dirt got dished. Anything Lavender and Parvati had would be  
> second hand, at best.
> Go check the DA list, all six non-Slytherin prefects from         
> Hermione's year were in the DA.  Hermione can, and does, network.
> <snip>
> If you don't believe that Hermione made a special study of Cho,
> consider for a moment that Hermione expected Cho to kiss Harry well
> before the fact.

Betsy Hp:
Oh, actually I totally agree with everything you've written above.  
What I took issue with was super-intuitive!Hermione who figured out 
Cho's issues by sheer empathy.  Which is just not Hermione.  
Networking!Hermione I totally buy.

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> <snip>
> If we're talking active collaboration, then I'm going to claim the
> palm.  As Ginny allowed Michael Corner to pick her up at the Yule
> Ball, it seems to me that Hermione started to give Ginny advice    
> about Harry as early as the opening of "Goblet", if not before.
> Go back and read the description of the Gryffindor Common room's
> occupants during Harry and Ginny's first kiss in HBP--Dean crushed 
> his glass, Ron was "wearing an expression appropriate to having    
> been clubbed over the head" but Hermione... Hermione "was beaming".
> She loves it when a plan comes together.  More importantly, I'd
> suggest, she loves it when two of her best friends finally come
> together.  

Betsy Hp:
Oh no, I think Hermione wants Ron for herself <g>.  But yes, I 
totally buy Hermoine as a fan of OBHWF.  And I also agree that she's 
manipulative.  So maybe Hermione is the first H/G shipper.  (And now 
she has Ginny fulfilling her purpose...) <eg>

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > And Hermione's attitude during GoF seemed much more "goodness    
> > this boy and girl thing is soo silly" than "this is what hopes   
> > and dreams are made of!<3!).  

> >>Amiable Dorsai:
> You're going to have to fire some more canon at me to get me to   
> accept that--what I recall is a Hermione who took the whole thing 
> very seriously indeed, to the point where she dolled herself up   
> for the first time we ever see, applying herself so assiduously to 
> the task that her two best male friends took a while to recognize 
> her.

Betsy Hp:
I was thinking more of Hermione's disdain for Harry and Ron worring 
over who they were going to take to the dance.  Hermione didn't 
really care all that much about it.  She didn't work to get Krum as 
a date, he worked to get her.  And while she did take some time to 
doll herself up, she was also very careful to point out that this 
was not her normal behavior.  It was just not all that stressful for 
Hermione, relative to Harry and Ron.

Betsy Hp