Hermione's Hex vs Snape on the Tower LONG (was:Re: Views of Hermione)

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 160619

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > <snip>
> > But no matter what Hermione may have felt in her heart, she told 
> > her recruits that they were signing up for a study group.
> > <snip of quote>
 
> >>Alla:
> I will answer you with Rebecca's post:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/?yguid=112798769
> She IMO brings a lot of canon, which makes it impossible for me to 
> understand how DADA cannot be considered created in the act of war.
> <snip of quotes>

Betsy Hp:
Oh, I'm quite sure several (not all, but most) of the students saw 
the importance of learning DADA for reasons beyond their OWLs.  But 
it's made *very* clear, IMO, that this was not an army being formed.

"We think the reason Umbridge doesn't want us trained in Defense 
Against the Dark Arts," said Hermione, "is that she's got some... 
some mad idea that Dumbledore could use the students in the school 
as a kind of private army.  She thinks he'd mobilize us against the 
Ministry."
"Nearly everybody looked stunned at this news; everybody except Luna 
Lovegood..." [OotP scholastic hardback p.344]

Hermione treats the idea of the DA being an actual army as a joke.  
Everyone at the meeting is "stunned" by the idea.  No one here 
thought they were being recruited into an army.  So as important as 
the students thought this study-group to be, they still saw it as a 
study-group rather than an act of war.

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > It's also been suggested that Hermione set the hex up as a 
> > defensive tactic.  Canon clearly tells us it's a punitive move.
> > <snip of quote>

> >>Alla:
> But, but but the defensive part meaning that this would be the 
> defense against Umbridge, no? That they will know and Umbridge    
> will not be able to do anything to them?

Betsy Hp:
That's not how it worked out, though.  Marietta told Umbridge, got 
her brand, Umbridge sent the IS after the DA group.  Dobby got there 
in time to warn most of the DA to flee, but not because of 
Marietta's spots. And Umbridge even figured out where most of the DA 
would flee to, and her IS managed to grab the list of members.

Umbridge was in a position to do *anything* to them.  Dumbledore 
saved the day here, not Hermione.

> >>Betsy: 
> > So, coming at the hex from the point of view (my pov <g>) that   
> > it does not take place in a war footing and that it was created 
> > to be punitive, the hex becomes a repulsive mockery of justice.  
> > It stinks of lynch mobs and kangaroo courts.
> > <SNIP>

> >>Alla:
> Of course if you not consider DADA creation to be the part of war 
> of course I understand your POV.

Betsy Hp:
Yay! <g>

> >>Alla:
> <snip> 
> But in any event, say you would agree that this was an act of war 
> and defensive measure, would you then view Hermione's actions 
> differently, just as you view Snape's?

Betsy Hp:
Hmm...  That would cast a bit of a different light on it.  One issue 
for me is that as a defensive measure it was an utter failure.  If 
this really were a war I'd expect Hermione to be called on the 
carpet for that.  And for making that sort of call all by herself.  
(She's not the leader of the group.  She passed that role over to 
Harry, therefore Harry should have been consulted about the hex.)

And... it's not really an aggressive move.  I suppose one could say 
that it identifies a spy, which is good.  But a flaw is, what if all 
of the DA were rounded up and questioned?  Harry was about to talk 
to Umbridge about the DA, so he'd have been marked too.  How many 
students (especially if they were questioned seperately) would have 
talked?  Would there have been anyway to figure out who spoke first 
if Umbridge was interested in keeping it a secret?

And there's still the fact that Marietta is left with what appears 
to be a permenant brand.  Now, if this were a real war setting, I'd 
expect her to be executed as a traitor (and the twins to be executed 
as deserters), so the brand would only be a problem for so long.  

I'd still be bothered by the fact that the members of this army were 
recruited under false pretenses.  That they weren't told flat out, 
we're at war, so war rules apply.

But yeah, if this had been written as occuring in an actual war 
setting, I suppose the brutality of the action would have bothered 
me a bit less. Though deliberate maiming as punishment is ugly even 
during war time, IMO.  So I'd certainly see Hermione as a 
particulary ruthless general.  Though, actually -- the failure of 
the hex to actually do anything, the favoritism of punishing the 
traitor but not the deserters...  I'd expect Hermione to be 
dismissed, quite frankly.  Found a nice quiet desk somewhere.  Too 
much brutality with too little pay-off.

Snape is still better.  His brutality actually has a massive pay-
off, no matter what side he ends up being on. <g>

Betsy Hp (kind of steam of thought this one, hope it makes sense <g>)