Godric's Hollow and the Fidelius Charm again (Was: Apparition & Secrets)

[justcarol67]

No: HPFGUIDX 167888

Carol earlier:
> > I'm not sure about the rules of Apparition, but neither Narcissa
in "Spinner's End" nor Dumbledore in "The Cave" Apparated to their 
> exact destination. <snip>
> 
> va32h responded:
> 
> I suspect Narcissa and Bella apparated in the woods to avoid being
seen by any Muggles - the same way wizards apparated into the woods
around the campground at the QWC instead of the campground itself. 
<snip>
> 
Carol again:
I don't remember any woods. Bella and Narcissa Apparate beside a nasty
river, but I thought that it was in a "Muggle dunghill." I do remember
a fox, which Bella kills, but no woods. Not that it matters, but my
sense of the scene was that Narcissa didn't know the exact location of
Snape's house, only the name of the town, which is, I think we agree,
all that Harry would need to know as well. He would just need to find
GH on a map, as I said before, and look around (or ask around). If GH
is a village, the ruins of the Potters' cottage won't be hard to find.

va32:
> Anyway, my point is, I think that if Harry knew his parents' address 
> (123 Golden Snitch Lane, for example) he could apparate directly to 
> the house. But since he only knows Godric's Hollow, he can apparate 
> there, and probably quickly find the house (surely someone in town 
> remembers the location of a spontaneous explosion 16 years ago).

Carol again:
Well, yes. That was essentially my point as well, only I don't think
he'd need the address. The name of the village, which he already
knows, should be sufficient once he knows where it is.
> 
Carol earlier:
<snip> If the cottage belonged to Albus Dumbledore and he gave or lent
it to the Potters as a hiding place, they could have been hiding there
for months before the danger intensified to the point where DD thought
they needed a Fidelius Charm. He could have visited them there himself
to make the suggestion, and the moment he "forgot" where they were
hiding, he would know that the charm was in place. 
> 
> va32h here:
> 
> Now I am truly confused, because I never thought that the Fidelius 
> Charm made you forget something you knew, it just made you unable to 
> tell anyone else. Snape certainly knows that 12 GP is the 
> headquarters of the Order, he just can't tell anyone, and he remarks 
> on the frustration of this to Bella in "Spinner's End". All the 
> members of the Order know where there headquarters are - it wouldn't 
> do them any good to have headquarters if they forgot where it was as 
> soon as Dumbledore became secret keeper. They just can't tell any
new members.
> 
> My thinking has always been that Lupin, Sirius, Hagrid, and anyone 
> else who might have visited the Potters knew where their house was, 
> and could visit it, but they were just magically prevented from 
> sharing that information with anyone else. <snip>

Carol:
I don't think they would know the Secret (the Potters' location) once
it had been hidden inside the Secret Keeper, even if they knew it
before. And if they did, they still wouldn't be able to see the
Potters at their home in GH. 

You're thinking of a person like Snape who has been told the Secret
(in Snape's case, the location of the Order HQ) by the Secret Keeper.
He knows the Secret but can't reveal it, just as the Potters could not
have revealed their own hiding place, even under torture, if they had
stepped outside it. But presumably once they stepped outside without
an Invisibility Cloak, they would be seen.

I'm talking about someone who knew the Potters' hiding place *before*
the Secret was concealed but was not told the Secret *by the Secret
Keeper* *after the Charm had been cast.* I think that person, for
example, Lupin or DD, would no longer no what he knew before because
that knowledge is now concealed inside the Secret Keeper. Unlike
Sirius Black, who knew the Secret but couldn't reveal it, they
wouldn't know the Secret because Wormtail hadn't told them. Their
knowledge before the Fidelius Charm was cast would be voided by the
Fidelius Charm, which requires the SK himself to tell the Secret in
order for it to be known.

Sorry if that's unclear, but that's how I understand the charm to
work. IMO, DD's sudden awareness of the Potters' hiding place was his
clue that the Potters were in grave danger or dead. And I think that
Snape, who also did not know the Secret, sensed the vaporization of
Voldemort when his Dark Mark rapidly faded. (Most likely, he felt
terrible pain first and then watched it disappear, or nearly so.)
Those two clues, together with the Prophecy, would tell DD that James
and Lily were probably dead, Voldemort's body was destroyed (but he
wasn't dead because he had at least one Horcrux), and Harry was alive
and "marked" as the one who could defeat the Dark Lord.

Carol, who realizes that others may understand the Fidelius Charm
differently but can only make sense of it if it works as she's described