Appeal of the story to the reader

[nitalynx]

No: HPFGUIDX 175656

<Snape's death and JKR's intentions>
> Nita earlier:
> <BIG SNIP> 
> > Well, thanks for that. I hope JKR really didn't intend any 
> gloating there.
> 
> 
Alla:
> 
> I do not know whether she intended or not, but for me satisfaction 
> came later when I realised how fitting Snape's death was ( IMO).
> 
> I am just saying that I did not feel like gloating when I read the 
> scene.

Nita now:

All right, minus half the thanks, then. I guess you and Lupinlore and
Irene have a point :)


<horror movies>
Alla:
> 
> Not for the sake of gloating per se, but basically for what va32h 
> said ( I guess I should add action movies here - some of them) - to 
> imagine doing to mean people what you cannot do in RL.
> 
> I do not think I do that when I read about Potterverse.

<Voldemort>
Alla:
>
> I  enjoyed watching him getting his just deserts and how Harry gets 
> there. It definitely worked for me. As I said, my point is that I do 
> not think that enjoying reading about villains being punished 
> appeals to my inner meanness, that's all.


Nita:

Hmm... I'm not sure I quite grasp the difference in principle between
taking revenge on mean people and punishing villains. Is it the
justice factor? Does what happen in Potterverse come off as more just
to you than what happens in action movies? (I'm not trying to imply
anything here, just to understand.)


> Nita earlier:
> 
> > I suppose you read it as a different kind of story. As houyhnhnm 
> said,
> > one is free to pick and choose in this series :)
> 
Alla:
> 
> Different from what? 


Nita now:

Different from the story lizzyben and Sydney and Betsy Hp and I and
others were reading, of course. The one that someone said was only in
our heads :)

But I think there *are* bits of different stories in the books, and
*that* is one of the reasons why they appeal (or used to appeal) to so
many different people. You want Bad Guys being punished? Here you go!
You want Bad Guys being human? Here's something for you, too! You want
a whimsical world and a healthy dose of humour? Sure! You want a scary
wartime story? Yes, it's here as well!

Of course, these bits are bound to conflict at certain points, and
resolving those conflicts in a universally satisfying way is almost
impossible. Hence the disappointment (for some).


Alla:
<snip>
> Putting aside Draco and some other examples, which we may disagree 
> on, I think Umbridge is a perfect one. You said it yourself - 
> Umbridge is unlikely to have many fans if any ( sorry to the fans of 
> the character if they exist).
> 
> She is a torturing sadist, isn't she? We can agree on that?
> 
> I do not think I want her to get what is coming because I cannot do 
> it in RL. In RL I would report somebody like her, testify, do 
> everything I can to make sure she ends up in jail. That would be RL 
> justice.
> 
> But this is not the story about conventional types of justice, no?
> 
> So, whatever Umbridge gets - wrath of the centaurs or anything, I 
> think is justice and of course I am glad that she does, you know?


Nita:

Ah, here we are. The unconventional justice :) From reading your
earlier posts, I understand that you keep real and fictional universes
well separated in your mind, so things that are *not* OK in real life
can be OK and even great in a story. Right?

Well, for some of us, the separating line is not all that
impenetrable. After all, both real-world processing and thinking about
books goes on in the same mind, *and* authors frequently try to say
things about our world in their imaginary stories (see "The Lottery"
by Shirley Jackson). So sometimes we need a reason why the rules of
the story-world are different from the normal ones.



Nita, wondering *why* conventional justice doesn't work in Potterverse...