DD and Horcruxes/ Scrimgeour

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 179622


> > Alla:
> > 
> > NO, it is more than tactical disagreement, I am afraid.
> > 
> > I suggest the **trust** the people mode as default one. NOT the 
> > limited people from the Order. OMG, who besides Mundungus is not 
> > deserving of Dumbledore's trust in your opinion?
> 
> Pippin:
> Er, haven't you often defended Hermione's jinx by saying  you 
> wished Dumbledore had used something like it  to 
> catch Pettigrew? That doesn't sound like trust to me. 

Alla:

Scratching her head. Would be nice if you quoted the exact sentence.
I seem to vaguely remember saying that Hermione's ginx may have 
saved the younger generation from the new Pettigrew in the mix.

And please, I indeed just vaguely remember that, so I may be wrong.

But if that is indeed what I was saying, I do not think this has 
anything to do with "trust people" as default mode. I certainly 
would not mind if Dumbledore decides to do something similar as 
extra insurance in case traitor shows up and that would indeed for 
me be perfect. He would show : a. that he trusts people BUT b. that 
he also takes extra precautions in case there is a traitor in the mi

Dumbledore supposed to be super intelligent and good judge of 
character, so I would leave it up to him to figure out exactly who 
the traitor is, not distrust everybody

Pippin:
> On the whole, I like Dumbledore's method better -- release 
> information on a 'need to know' basis and you won't have to set 
> traps for your own side (it wasn't *his* idea to make Pettigrew
> the secret keeper.)

Alla:

Except it seems that he did not release information to some people 
who indeed **needed** to know it in a sense that they could have 
helped Harry in the hunt. And as I said, I have no problems with DD 
setting spell as precaution, while warning people in advance.

Here you go guys, I am about to share something super secret with 
you, something that needed to be guarded beyond belief ( info about 
Horcruxes), and then to make it without Hermione's mistakes - 
anybody who feels that he is not strong enough to keep this a 
secret, please leave now. I also have to warn you that if you betray 
us, I don't know something happens to let everybody know - your lips 
will be sealed forever or something.

Personally I love it. Harry gets help and if somebody tries to 
betray, they are done deal.

Again, this is my hypothetical, and again what Dumbledore did as 
leader works perfectly for me - in a sense that he was deeply 
secretive and manipulative and very problematic leader, while maybe 
wishing well.

Pippin:
  I wouldn't trust anyone not to betray 
> the Order under any circumstances. Everyone has a breaking point 
> and Voldemort is very good at figuring out what they are. 
> 
> It is dangerous to know Voldemort's secrets. He would have killed
> anyone he suspected of knowing about the horcruxes, and short
> of blanketing the wizarding world with the information there would
> have been no way to stop him from trying to do so. 

Alla:

It is dangerous to fight the war. I think Order members signed up 
for it - including sharing information from their leader, even if 
this is dangerous, IMO.

 
> Alla:
<SNIP>
> Now, maybe whole trauma was that Pettigrew outsmarted him and not
> because he felt the slightest bit of sorry for Sirius' sufferings,
I do
> not know that, but yes, I believe it is possible he was 
traumatised.

a_svirn:
<SNIPPPPPPP>
But it wasn't *him* whom Pettigrew outsmarted. It was Sirius. Who
sure was traumatised by the whole thing. <SNIP>


Alla:

Well, yeah, but my point is that it IS sort of outsmarting 
Dumbledore too IMO - that he was made to believe that Sirius is 
guilty. I speculate, only speculate that it was possible to cause 
trauma.



I mean look I would have been traumatised if I knew that some 
**sshole made me think that innocent man is guilty and that I caused 
that man so much grief and pain.

So, when I am feeling charitable to DD I think that maybe he was 
too :)

JMO,

Alla